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11/24/2008 06:42:03 PM · #1 |
Most of what you read in this article has been erased from our textbooks. Revisionists have rewritten history to remove the truth about our country's Christian roots. Mary Jones, the designer of this web page, encourage all who read and agree with the words herein, to share it with others, so that the truth of our nation's history may be told.
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Did you know that 52 of the 55 signers of The Declaration of Independence were orthodox, deeply committed Christians? The other three all believed in the Bible as the divine truth, the God of scripture, and His personal intervention.
It is the same congress that formed the American Bible Society. Immediately after creating the Declaration of Independence, the Continental Congress voted to purchase and import 20,000 copies of scripture for the people of this nation.
Patrick Henry, who is called the firebrand of the American Revolution, is still remembered for his words, 'Give me liberty or give me death.' But in current textbooks the context of these words is deleted. Here is what he said: 'An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death.'
These sentences have been erased from our textbooks.
Was Patrick Henry a Christian? The following year, 1776, he wrote this 'It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religion, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For that reason alone, people of other faiths have been afforded freedom of worship here.'
Consider these words that Thomas Jefferson wrote on the front of his well- worn Bible: 'I am a Christian, that is to say a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus. I have little doubt that our whole country will soon be rallied to the unity of our Creator and, I hope, to the pure doctrine of Jesus also.'
Consider these words from George Washington, the Father of our Nation, in his farewell speech on September 19, 1796:
'It is impossible to govern the world without God and the Bible. Of all the dispositions and habits that lead to political prosperity, our religion and morality are the indispensable supporters. Let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that our national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.'
Was George Washington a Christian? Consider these words from his personal prayer book: 'Oh, eternal and everlasting God, direct my thoughts, words and work. Wash away my sins in the immaculate blood of the lamb and purge my heart by the Holy Spirit. Daily, frame me more and more in the likeness of thy son, Jesus Christ, that living in thy fear, and dying in thy favor, I may in thy appointed time obtain the resurrection of the justified unto eternal life. Bless, O Lord, the whole race of mankind and let the world be filled with the knowledge of thy son, Jesus Christ.'
Consider these words by John Adams, our second president, who also served as chairman of the American Bible Society.
In an address to military leaders he said, 'We have no government armed with the power capable of contending with human passions, unbridled by morality and true religion. Our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.'
How about our first Court Justice, John Jay?
He stated that when we select our national leaders, if we are to preserve our Nation, we must select Christians. 'Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers and it is the duty as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian Nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers.'
John Quincy Adams, son of John Adams, was the sixth U.S. President.
He was also the chairman of the American Bible Society, which he considered his highest and most important role. On July 4, 1821, President Adams said, 'The highest glory of the American Revolution was this: it connected in one indissoluble bond the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity.'
Calvin Coolidge, our 30th President of the United States reaffirmed this truth when he wrote, 'The foundations of our society and our government rest so much on the teachings of the Bible that it would be difficult to support them if faith in these teachings would cease to be practically universal in our country.'
In 1782, the United States Congress voted this resolution: 'The congress of the United States recommends and approves the Holy Bible for use in all schools.'
William Holmes McGuffey is the author of the McGuffey Reader, which was used for over 100 years in our public schools with over 125 million copies sold until it was stopped in 1963. President Lincoln called him the 'Schoolmaster of the Nation.'
Listen to these words of Mr. McGuffey: 'The Christian religion is the religion of our country. From it are derived our notions on character of God, on the great moral Governor of the universe. On its doctrines are founded the peculiarities of our free institutions. From no source has the author drawn more conspicuously than from the sacred Scriptures. From all these extracts from the Bible I make no apology.'
Of the first 108 universities founded in America, 106 were distinctly Christian, including the first.
Harvard University, chartered in 1636. In the original Harvard Student Handbook rule number 1 was that students seeking entrance must know Latin and Greek so that they could study the scriptures:
'Let every student be plainly instructed and earnestly pressed to consider well, the main end of his life and studies is, to know God and Jesus Christ, which is eternal life, John 17:3; and therefore to lay Jesus Christ as the only foundation of all sound knowledge and learning. And seeing the Lord only giveth wisdom, let everyone seriously set himself by prayer in secret to seek it of him (Proverbs 2:3).'
For over 100 years, more than 50% of all Harvard graduates were pastors!
It is clear from history that the Bible and the Christian faith, were foundational in our educational and judicial system. However in 1947, there was a radical change of direction in the Supreme Court.
Here is the prayer that was banished:
'Almighty God, we acknowledge our dependence on Thee. We beg Thy blessings upon us and our parents and our teachers and our country.
Amen.'
In 1963, the Supreme Court ruled that Bible reading was outlawed as unconstitutional in the public school system. The court offered this justification: 'If portions of the New Testament were read without explanation, they could and have been psychologically harmful to children.'
Bible reading was now unconstitutional , though the Bible was quoted 94 percent of the time by those who wrote our constitution and shaped our Nation and its system of education and justice and government.
In 1965, the Courts denied as unconstitutional the rights of a student in the public school cafeteria to bow his head and pray audibly for his food.
In 1980, Stone vs. Graham outlawed the Ten Commandments in our public schools.
The Supreme Court said this: 'If the posted copies of the Ten Commandments were to have any effect at all, it would be to induce school children to read them. And if they read them, meditated upon them, and perhaps venerated and observed them, this is not a permissible objective.'
Is it not a permissible objective to allow our children to follow the moral principles of the Ten Commandments?
James Madison, the primary author of the Constitution of the United States, said this: 'We have staked the whole future of our new nation, not upon the power of government; far from it. We have staked the future of all our political constitutions upon the capacity of each of ourselves to govern ourselves according to the moral principles of the Ten Commandments.'
Today we are asking God to bless America. But how can He bless a Nation that has departed so far from Him?
Message edited by author 2008-11-24 18:43:00. |
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11/24/2008 06:55:39 PM · #2 |
/me counts the minutes until this hits rant.
Matt
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11/24/2008 06:59:12 PM · #3 |
| I'm just wondering what the point is (or if there IS one). |
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11/24/2008 07:02:00 PM · #4 |
wow ....
relevance?
I'd also like to point out that just because it's history, that doesn't make it right or legitimate...
(raised Catholic here) |
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11/24/2008 07:08:46 PM · #5 |
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11/24/2008 07:13:47 PM · #6 |
This is a very interesting article. It does show a real pattern in the time line of the government taking religion's influence out of it's decisions. I do feel this country is slipping into a less religious country as time goes on. Probably mostly because many people feel that too many religions are so convinced that they are the right one. When you have so many factions of the Christian religion feeling they are the only one right it can get messy. Separation of church and state is written into the Constitution for this very reason I feel. To prevent any one religion from influencing the government to implement it's rules and regulations. Now the major religions all agree on a few different things: Don't kill each other, don't steal, and do to your neighbor as you would have one on to you.
Now the problem with reading the Bible in public schools is that Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, atheist, andy many other religions kids attend these schools as well. Just think about how a Christian would feel about their child having the Koran or Torah read to them in school. I would imagine that would not go over well at all. I feel that as a society we do have a responsibility to teach good morals and manners, but I do not feel any one has a right to push their religion on others. As far as the ten commandments, just having the "Thou shall not worship any other God but me." commandment at school would make a Hindu or Buddhist child feel very uncomfortable.
Don't get me wrong but I feel that pointing out that as time goes on our government continues to respect all faiths (As we have been promised by our founders) by Removing one specific faith from public schools and laws is more a sign of progress than regression. I consider myself a spiritual person. I believe in God, and i believe that Jesus died for our sins on the cross. But i also believe that everyone has a right to believe in what they want. The government catering to one specific religion is my definition of BIG GOVERNMENT!
Just my 2 cents.....
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11/24/2008 07:27:12 PM · #7 |
oh.... man....
Whiny voice off...
David, I'm sure you have some very passionate beliefs. Many of us do. However, it is often considered bad form to wander into someone else's home and badger them about religion.
Would you do this in real life? Would you walk into any gathering, and start in? I know the anonymity of the internet lessens inhibitions, but that is not necessarily a good thing. If the answer was no, then it is not a good idea to do it here. If it was yes, then... I think I'd probably wander to another room.
Hopefully you have your asbestos undies on, because those who follow may not be so kind...
Ignore mode |
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11/24/2008 07:41:27 PM · #8 |
yep + alot of the founding fathers had slaves ..
bet most would have believed in eugenics
so how enlighted were they ?
we've come along way since then ... |
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11/24/2008 07:54:47 PM · #9 |
(David Ey) + (Long Post) = (Religious Stuff)
:-)
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11/24/2008 07:58:09 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
I'm just wondering what the point is (or if there IS one). |
To establish the quickest route to rant. |
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11/24/2008 08:01:45 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by ambaker:
Would you do this in real life? Would you walk into any gathering, and start in? I know the anonymity of the internet lessens inhibitions, but that is not necessarily a good thing. If the answer was no, then it is not a good idea to do it here. If it was yes, then... I think I'd probably wander to another room.
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Judging from the profile he's been in this room for six years. So is suspect he knew the hate this post would rouse. |
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11/24/2008 08:09:37 PM · #12 |
Why ask God to Bless the US indeed?
A pointless exercise really, you might as well ask the refrigerator for forgiveness and eternal life. Actually asking an appliance might be better since the refrigerator actually exists and it'll keep your beer cold.
Message edited by author 2008-11-24 20:11:50. |
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11/24/2008 08:22:28 PM · #13 |
Who cares?
A lot of things happened in the past. It doesn't make them correct and it doesn't make them relevant to the modern day. In retrospect, many have been realized to have been bad ideas, or at least well out of vogue.
And just because something was back then is a lousy reason to keep doing it today.
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11/24/2008 08:36:35 PM · #14 |
(edited to change boring article into interesting quotes without putting this tripe of a thread back at the top of the list)
Not sure exactly what the OP was trying to say, but I have a pretty good guess. In the style/form of the OP I offer this rebuttal:
The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense founded on the Christian religion
(article by Jim Walker here)
Jim Walker's article is great, but here are some of the founders in their own words:
Thomas Paine was a pamphleteer whose manifestos encouraged the faltering spirits of the country and aided materially in winning the war of Independence:
I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of...Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all."
-The Age of Reason by Thomas Paine, pp. 8,9 (Republished 1984, Prometheus Books, Buffalo, NY)
George Washington, the first president of the United States, never declared himself a Christian according to contemporary reports or in any of his voluminous correspondence. Washington Championed the cause of freedom from religious intolerance and compulsion. When John Murray (a universalist who denied the existence of hell) was invited to become an army chaplain, the other chaplains petitioned Washington for his dismissal. Instead, Washington gave him the appointment. On his deathbed, Washinton uttered no words of a religious nature and did not call for a clergyman to be in attendance.
-George Washington and Religion by Paul F. Boller Jr., pp. 16, 87, 88, 108, 113, 121, 127 (1963, Southern Methodist University Press, Dallas, TX)
John Adams, the country's second president, was drawn to the study of law but faced pressure from his father to become a clergyman. He wrote that he found among the lawyers 'noble and gallant achievments" but among the clergy, the "pretended sanctity of some absolute dunces". Late in life he wrote: "Twenty times in the course of my late reading, have I been upon the point of breaking out, "This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it!"
It was during Adam's administration that the Senate ratified the Treaty of Peace and Friendship, which states in Article XI that "the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion."
-The Character of John Adams by Peter Shaw, pp. 17 (1976, North Carolina Press, Chapel Hill, NC) Quoting a letter by JA to Charles Cushing Oct 19, 1756, and John Adams, A Biography in his Own Words, edited by James Peabody, p. 403 (1973, Newsweek, New York NY) Quoting letter by JA to Jefferson April 19, 1817, and in reference to the treaty, Thomas Jefferson, Passionate Pilgrim by Alf Mapp Jr., pp. 311 (1991, Madison Books, Lanham, MD) quoting letter by TJ to Dr. Benjamin Waterhouse, June, 1814.
Thomas Jefferson, third president and author of the Declaration of Independence, said:"I trust that there is not a young man now living in the United States who will not die a Unitarian." He referred to the Revelation of St. John as "the ravings of a maniac" and wrote:
The Christian priesthood, finding the doctrines of Christ levelled to every understanding and too plain to need explanation, saw, in the mysticisms of Plato, materials with which they might build up an artificial system which might, from its indistinctness, admit everlasting controversy, give employment for their order, and introduce it to profit, power, and pre-eminence. The doctrines which flowed from the lips of Jesus himself are within the comprehension of a child; but thousands of volumes have not yet explained the Platonisms engrafted on them: and for this obvious reason that nonsense can never be explained."
-Thomas Jefferson, an Intimate History by Fawn M. Brodie, p. 453 (1974, W.W) Norton and Co. Inc. New York, NY) Quoting a letter by TJ to Alexander Smyth Jan 17, 1825, and Thomas Jefferson, Passionate Pilgrim by Alf Mapp Jr., pp. 246 (1991, Madison Books, Lanham, MD) quoting letter by TJ to John Adams, July 5, 1814.
James Madison, fourth president and father of the Constitution, was not religious in any conventional sense. "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution."
-The Madisons by Virginia Moore, P. 43 (1979, McGraw-Hill Co. New York, NY) quoting a letter by JM to William Bradford April 1, 1774, and James Madison, A Biography in his Own Words, edited by Joseph Gardner, p. 93, (1974, Newsweek, New York, NY) Quoting Memorial and Remonstrance against Religious Assessments by JM, June 1785.
Ethan Allen, whose capture of Fort Ticonderoga while commanding the Green Mountain Boys helped inspire Congress and the country to pursue the War of Independence, said, "That Jesus Christ was not God is evidence from his own words." In the same book, Allen noted that he was generally "denominated a Deist, the reality of which I never disputed, being conscious that I am no Christian." When Allen married Fanny Buchanan, he stopped his own wedding ceremony when the judge asked him if he promised "to live with Fanny Buchanan agreeable to the laws of God." Allen refused to answer until the judge agreed that the God referred to was the God of Nature, and the laws those "written in the great book of nature."
-Religion of the American Enlightenment by G. Adolph Koch, p. 40 (1968, Thomas Crowell Co., New York, NY.) quoting preface and p. 352 of Reason, the Only Oracle of Man and A Sense of History compiled by American Heritage Press Inc., p. 103 (1985, American Heritage Press, Inc., New York, NY.)
Benjamin Franklin, delegate to the Continental Congress and the Constitutional Convention, said:
As to Jesus of Nazareth, my Opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the System of Morals and his Religion...has received various corrupting Changes, and I have, with most of the present dissenters in England, some doubts as to his Divinity; tho' it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it now, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the Truth with less trouble." He died a month later, and historians consider him, like so many great Americans of his time, to be a Deist, not a Christian.
-Benjamin Franklin, A Biography in his Own Words, edited by Thomas Fleming, p. 404, (1972, Newsweek, New York, NY) quoting letter by BF to Exra Stiles March 9, 1970.
Message edited by author 2008-11-24 21:01:35. |
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11/24/2008 08:41:20 PM · #15 |
I find nothing noxious in the quotes. And there is no reason not to ponder them. True I have been suspected of being a bible thumper, something I am also willing to ponder.
I seem to remember that the English philosopher John Locke was called upon to help establish the principles of government, and it was his belief that God was in some way necessary to guarantee them. There were not that many people roaming about the Eastern US at that time who were not Christians, although indeed there were Portugese Jews who predated the Pilgrim fathers, Native people with their own beliefs and practices, and likely a number of Muslims among people of African descent. And yet among the Christians there were vast differences: some came to escape persecution in England, what is now Germany, and Russia; others, mostly Anglicans and Catholics, had lesser persecution issues, if any. And even among these groups there were some sore divisions the Orthodox Quakers and the Hicksite Quakers; Roger Williams broke from the Pilgrims to found Rhode Island on the basis of religious freedom. I think it safe to say that most of the founding fathers, for all that they were believers, were sensitive to these matters, and their intention was not to impose belief and teaching and practice, but to reflect their belief.
Possibly a slight difference. Or even a deceptive one? But I rather hope it is a real one, and that for all I may rue the nation's children being deprived of even reading a very interesting and historically significant book In School, no one has thereby been prevented from living his or her life as he or she believes God sees fit for her or him to do. |
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11/24/2008 08:55:02 PM · #16 |
If you want to claim revisionist history, look no further than the letter you posted.
"I have recently been examining all the known superstitions of the world, and do not find in our particular superstition (Christianity) one redeeming feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology." - Thomas Jefferson
"Experience witnesseth that ecclesiastical establishments, instead of maintaining the purity and efficacy of religion, have had a contrary operation. During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution." - James Madison
"The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses." - John Quincy Adams
"We have abundant reason to rejoice that in this Land the light of truth and reason has triumphed over the power of bigotry and superstition ... In this enlightened Age and in this Land of equal liberty it is our boast, that a man's religious tenets will not forfeit the protection of the Laws, nor deprive him of the right of attaining and holding the highest Offices that are known in the United States." - George Washington (That prayer book quote is bogus. Washington never mentioned Christ in his writings aside from one poem penned as a child). |
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11/24/2008 09:22:06 PM · #17 |
Just to throw something totally random into this thread....I'm related to John Quincy Adams (not very closely, but he is listed in our genealogy (along with John Alden, Priscilla Mullins, several French Kings and a couple of Norse Kings). At least that's what I've seen in the Official "Wert" history.
You can all go back to your .... whatever now. *grin* |
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11/24/2008 10:14:49 PM · #18 |
Mary Jones
It seems the present day MJ is on a mission from god. Maybe she has been reborn? |
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11/24/2008 11:51:39 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by David Ey:
Was George Washington a Christian? Consider these words from his personal prayer book: 'Oh, eternal and everlasting God, direct my thoughts, words and work. Wash away my sins in the immaculate blood of the lamb and purge my heart by the Holy Spirit. Daily, frame me more and more in the likeness of thy son, Jesus Christ, that living in thy fear, and dying in thy favor, I may in thy appointed time obtain the resurrection of the justified unto eternal life. Bless, O Lord, the whole race of mankind and let the world be filled with the knowledge of thy son, Jesus Christ.' |
According to Frank Grizzard (senior associate editor of the George Washington Papers collection at University of Virginia), in a correspondence with Ed Brayton of the blog Dispatches from the Culture Wars, the Washington prayer book, while not necessarily a fraud, is not in Washington̢۪s handwriting and didn̢۪t reflect Washington̢۪s other known writings with regard to religious belief.
Writes Brayton:
When I first came across these claims I emailed Frank Grizzard, a historian who specializes in the life of George Washington and the editor of the Washington collection at the University of Virginia. He said the journal was absolutely not from Washington, and in a 2005 book he showed handwriting samples showing that the handwriting ni (sic) the journal did not match Washington's at all.
Apparently, the handwritten prayer book was found in a trunk of Washington̢۪s relatives heirlooms. (I̢۪m writing this next part from memory, so may be off in details.) At that time, the current owner, looking at a possible business opportunity, sent the book for verification to the Smithsonian Institute. Washington experts at the Smithsonian informed the owner of the prayer book was not in Washington̢۪s handwriting and had most likely been written by one of his relatives. The seller, not wanting the truth get in the way of a good sale, ignored the news from the Smithsonian and sold the prayer book as having been written by Washington anyway.
Message edited by author 2008-11-24 23:53:40. |
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11/25/2008 12:15:39 AM · #20 |
| Oops. I stand way corrected about the alleged Christianity of the founding fathers. (Old age, dim memory). Nice work, posters. |
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11/25/2008 10:05:16 AM · #21 |
America's real history starts with the genocide and displacement of millions of Native Americans and was build on the backs of slavery.
Don't be ignorant. |
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11/25/2008 10:07:04 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
America's real history starts with the genocide and displacement of millions of Native Americans and was build on the backs of slavery.
Don't be ignorant. |
What are you doing spreading truth around like it was fact. sheesh! ;) |
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11/25/2008 11:01:36 AM · #23 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
America's real history starts with the genocide and displacement of millions of Native Americans and was build on the backs of slavery.
Don't be ignorant. |
Careful - you are speaking of my (native - most likely Iroquis) ancestry there. Please feel free to right this wrong and leave - so that we can go back to killing and enslaving our own - via our traditions.
Please enlighten me (so that I won't be ignorant), of any peoples through early history that have not engaged in the practice of conquering and enslaving the conquered. I seem to be at a loss of recollecting exceptions to this historic fact. Your implication is that we (America) are to be dispised due to our history. At least be consistent and dispise every government or War Chief that ruled - after conquering another. |
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11/25/2008 11:32:18 AM · #24 |
Originally posted by Flash:
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
America's real history starts with the genocide and displacement of millions of Native Americans and was build on the backs of slavery.
Don't be ignorant. |
Careful - you are speaking of my (native - most likely Iroquis) ancestry there. Please feel free to right this wrong and leave - so that we can go back to killing and enslaving our own - via our traditions.
Please enlighten me (so that I won't be ignorant), of any peoples through early history that have not engaged in the practice of conquering and enslaving the conquered. I seem to be at a loss of recollecting exceptions to this historic fact. Your implication is that we (America) are to be dispised due to our history. At least be consistent and dispise every government or War Chief that ruled - after conquering another. |
Do you still ascribe to this Neolithic way of thinking? |
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11/25/2008 11:59:44 AM · #25 |
Welcome back to the conversation... jump in Jac, Flash.
Sorry, couldn't resist. ;-P |
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