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05/09/2006 10:31:56 PM · #1 |
I think I have a dead pixel. I can't show you because I entered the shot in a challenge. It showed up in only 2 of the 10 shots I took today. It is a little northeast of dead center.
I have a D70. It made 1 year old about a week ago. I have an extended warranty on it. If this pixel stays dead, should I send it in or live and clone?
Thanks,
KS |
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05/10/2006 12:43:34 AM · #2 |
tough call, I think I'd probably send it in as knowing I've got a hot pixel would bother me.
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05/10/2006 01:21:02 AM · #3 |
I wish i had just 1 hot or dead pixle. I have about 5 to 7 hot pixles :-/
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05/11/2006 10:27:57 AM · #4 |
Definitely send it in.
You would be surprised how irritating it will become later on... especially when you forget it... :)
Further, it's not uncommon to have dead, stuck or hot pixels... all that needs to be done is to have them remapped.
There's already plenty of 'information sharing' going on inside these bayer sensors, and you probably already have a number of faulty pixels kicking around in there.
Manufacturers deal with this by doing a sensor map at the factory and your camera applies this map to all images as they are recorded. All it does is shares information from neighboring pixels and takes care of itself... kinda like an autoclone...
It's no big deal, and you might be surprised if you take it in and they tell you that you can pick it up in an hour... It's all software manipulation.
Definitely take it in to the nearest service center rather than mailing it if at all possible.
Jent, this might not apply to you if the pixels are next to each other. That's a major issue. On the other hand, if the pixels are all over, you should be able to get this taken care of just the same. Even outside of warranty, I don't think it costs much... call and ask?
Message edited by author 2006-05-11 10:29:08. |
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05/11/2006 11:05:24 AM · #5 |
I think hot and dead pixels are different things. Dead pixels don't record light *at all* - they are always dead and show as distinct white or black spots, all the time.
Hot pixels, on the other hand, don't normally appear during short exposures, but as soon as you go up over say 1 second shutter speed they start over-reacting and show up as bright spots.
In-camera noise reduction is designed to cancel out the long exposure hot pixel effect. And pixel remapping is used for compensating for dead pixels. Do I have that right? |
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05/11/2006 11:43:57 AM · #6 |
Originally posted by eschelar:
Definitely send it in.
You would be surprised how irritating it will become later on... especially when you forget it... :)
Further, it's not uncommon to have dead, stuck or hot pixels... all that needs to be done is to have them remapped.
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They dont have that option on your camera in the main menu? So Olympus can shake the dust and remap pixels all at the same time! Man just another reason I am happy I bought an Olympus. Get a dead pixel just push a few buttons and remap and go on. Never had one, but I'd hate the thought of having to send one of my babies away for something that can be done in camera with it in my own hands.
MattO
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05/11/2006 11:56:59 AM · #7 |
MattO that's really cool that Olympus does that. Illustrates my point quite well too..
Jhonan. I think you are close, but not quite...
You are correct that dead, stuck and hot pixels are all different things.
Dead pixels return no information and are electronically dead. Something is severed or broken. A pixel map ignores this pixel and borrows information from neighboring pixels.
Hot pixels are pixels that have increased sensitivity over the norm. This is caused by a number of different manufacturing inconsistencies natural to things made so ridiculously tiny. Hot pixels usually also refers to pixels that return less information than the norm. Most pixels are nor 100% standardized in their effect. The pixel map at the factory will generally have a compensation which works very nicely for most situations... These pixels are the ones that cause noise when ISO is magnified (hence magnifying the differences from pixel to pixel) or when exposure time increases (for similar reasons). The base pixel map corrects for this and the Noise Reduction step adds a further level of correction APPROPRIATE FOR THE USAGE. This last bit is important because this is a difference in sensitivity, so the visibility of said pixel is different with different temperatures, ISOs, and exposure times... Hot pixels are mapped in two different ways. One is at the factory, the other is at the noise reduction step. Some hot pixels are wildly overactive and are completely mapped out. Sometimes these are called stuck pixels.
Stuck pixels usually refers to a pixel that is wildly oversensitive OR a pixel that has a physical dislocation to cause a malfunction. This is quite common as an error on LCD screens which have a different kind of pixel, but the principle is the same. LCD screens can often be 'massaged' to return said pixel to a working state. This is not generally recommended for sensor photosites...
Stuck pixels are often a cause of intermittent dead or hot pixels, but are by nature a different type of malfunction. The fix is either to repair the physical damage or... remap.
Different causes. Generally, the camera company will use the same solution... It works out because even at any one photosite, 2/3 to 1/2 of the information is already being interpolated from neighboring photosites. We don't generally notice this (mainly because we don't usually get a chance to shoot non-interpolated sensors), so we likewise are unlikely to notice if the remaining information is also interpolated for a single pixel remap. |
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05/11/2006 12:59:50 PM · #8 |
so here is another question....my local camera shop does not fix this. So where would I send my camera to to get it fixed? Any clue on how much and how long it would take for such a remap?
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05/11/2006 01:15:46 PM · #9 |
Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if your local camera shop doesn't fix it.
You will need to go to an official Canon service center.
You will probably be out of warranty, so they might try to charge you.
If you don't know the local official Canon service center, you could try online, or better yet, call your local camera shop and ask them where the local Canon Service Center is.
Depending on how good they are, they may or may not know anything about sensor remapping, so don't worry them about it.
Alternatively, you could email Canon themselves... ask them what to do or where to go... mention to them that the Olympus has this in-camera... maybe they will send you an app for it, or better yet, show you how to do it yourself... don't count on it though...
I am pretty sure they do this just over the basic USB connection.
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05/11/2006 01:27:18 PM · #10 |
Just thought I would let you guys know. I called the canon service center in CA. They said that if the only thing it needs is a remaping it would be a $180. They said most the time they don't need to replace any hardware and it will be just that price. Also they used to ship the software to do this to service stations, but they don't do that any longer and you have to ship it to canon.
IMO 5 hot pixles is not worth 180bux plus about 20 days without my beloved 10d. The only thing that frustrates me is one of them is pretty close to the center. But oh well, I am not paying 180bux for this. Let me know if you guys know any alternative.
Also on a clerficiation of DPC basic editing rules. You can't remove hot pixles can you? Would that be classified as spot editing? I have not removed any yet because of this assumption but maybe you guys know something I don't. Thanks
Message edited by author 2006-05-11 13:27:35.
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05/11/2006 01:31:57 PM · #11 |
In basic editing rules, you're stuck with the hot pixels. Major bummer.
I seem to recall, at some point, reading a thread or link about software for remapping that was available to the consumer. I don't know any more about it than that, but it might be worth doing a google search. |
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05/12/2006 11:36:25 AM · #12 |
WOW! What a stunning ripoff job!
Man that blows big time.
It's a totally easy thing for them to do at local service centers... Definitely check the net for hacks...
That's seriously atrocious!
I thought that the last time I heard of someone doing this it was like 60 bucks US... even that's pretty pathetic for 5-10 minutes of plugging a camera in and running a program...
Of course they wouldn't have to change any hardware... Lame and a half...
Message edited by author 2006-05-12 11:38:07. |
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05/12/2006 12:05:09 PM · #13 |
Just thought I would add that I googled and found a couple of threads that indicated that the 5D and 30D include a sensor map after going through sensor clean mode. This takes about 1 second apparently.
The information was found posted by a 5D user and confirmed by a significant number of users on dpreview forums...
I am going to guess that this is a new feature.
I would try the following things for the 10D:
Try to do the sensor clean mode, just a quick cycle... I am going to say the odds are pretty low that this will work... I'm also going to guess that you have done this at least once in the ownership of this camera, so I'm not going to hold my breath here.
Next, try using the factory reset... press and hold the menu button for more than 5 seconds. It will bring up a special reset menu which is the 'factory reset'...
Next, if that doesn't work, also try a removal of the small battery and let the camera sit for say 24 hours (to discharge the internal capacitors)... That will probably give the camera a 'very hard reset' similar to what we do for really badly mucked up PDA's...
If you are lucky, one of these steps will initiate an in-camera sensor map...
If not, gak!
Incidentally, my search results also came up with reports that it cost in the neighborhood of 200 USD for a nikon remap too.. they even claimed to have replaced a CCD too... |
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