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06/19/2015 11:26:47 AM · #76 |
| the fact that South Carolina is allowed to actively fly the flag that symbolized pro segregation and white supremacy is appalling. |
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06/19/2015 11:28:43 AM · #77 |
Originally posted by Mike:
i wish to rescind my solution.
its apparent that until we can change human behavior, we don't deserve to be able to own guns. just take them all away. |
Perhaps a people who think they 'deserve' to own guns get what they deserve? |
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06/19/2015 11:45:41 AM · #78 |
Originally posted by ubique:
Originally posted by Mike:
i wish to rescind my solution.
its apparent that until we can change human behavior, we don't deserve to be able to own guns. just take them all away. |
Perhaps a people who think they 'deserve' to own guns get what they deserve? |
no doubt a high price is paid. but I don't think that most people who defend their rights to own guns feel any responsibility whatsoever for the deaths that occur because of the ease of access to and prevalence of firearms. It's somebody else, or another neighbourhood, or black people, or mental health issues, or lower class people, just not them. The sad, other side of American individualism and pioneer spirit seems to be a lack of collective responsibility for gun crime.
In London (where I live) we had our own hater - he hated Asians, Blacks, Gay people and he went on a three day bombing spree at the end of the 90s : [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Copeland ]nail bomber[/url] he was limited simply by the weapons/explosives he could obtain. In America, he could really have gone to town... |
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06/19/2015 11:46:05 AM · #79 |
| Sad, but true, the words you speak, Paul. Really, the cold hard truth is that not that many people die in mass shootings, percentage wise. We as a country seem to accept that as collateral damage, so to speak. Some facts and figures (add salt, flavor to taste) from the Washington Post. |
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06/19/2015 12:13:11 PM · #80 |
www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pOiOhxujsE
I cant believe i missed this.. The way he turns the activists own words against him is brilliant.
Message edited by author 2015-06-19 12:13:36. |
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06/19/2015 12:25:49 PM · #81 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Sad, but true, the words you speak, Paul. Really, the cold hard truth is that not that many people die in mass shootings, percentage wise. We as a country seem to accept that as collateral damage, so to speak. Some facts and figures (add salt, flavor to taste) from the Washington Post. |
the smoking gun...
"7. More guns tend to mean more homicide.
The Harvard Injury Control Research Center assessed the literature on guns and homicide and found that there's substantial evidence that indicates more guns means more murders." |
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06/19/2015 12:28:48 PM · #82 |
| If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
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06/19/2015 12:32:15 PM · #83 |
| I live in a small town in Western Colorado, our murder rate is essentially non existent and our gun ownership rate is through the roof. |
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06/19/2015 12:32:28 PM · #84 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
i agree but in the mean time its still a place to focus. |
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06/19/2015 12:33:48 PM · #85 |
Originally posted by chazoe:
I live in a small town in Western Colorado, our murder rate is essentially non existent and our gun ownership rate is through the roof. |
interestingly if gun ownership wasn't through the roof, you'd still have essentially a non-existent murder rate.
Message edited by author 2015-06-19 12:34:03. |
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06/19/2015 12:34:26 PM · #86 |
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by chazoe:
I live in a small town in Western Colorado, our murder rate is essentially non existent and our gun ownership rate is through the roof. |
interestingly if gun ownership wasn't through the roof, you'd still have essentially a non-existent murder rate. |
And? |
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06/19/2015 12:39:01 PM · #87 |
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
i agree but in the mean time its still a place to focus. |
So, focus on what's sensationalized instead of what the real problems are...makes sense to me. It's like buying a car covered in rust, with the windows busted out and 4 bald, flat tires that runs on 3 cylinders because you like blue. |
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06/19/2015 12:40:00 PM · #88 |
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by chazoe:
I live in a small town in Western Colorado, our murder rate is essentially non existent and our gun ownership rate is through the roof. |
interestingly if gun ownership wasn't through the roof, you'd still have essentially a non-existent murder rate. |
If we lived in magic fairy land, we could all ride unicorns and eat magic beans |
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06/19/2015 12:40:49 PM · #89 |
Originally posted by chazoe:
I live in a small town in Western Colorado, our murder rate is essentially non existent and our gun ownership rate is through the roof. |
lucky old you.
but impossible to tell:
how many gun owners in your town sell their guns on to people in other places who then kill.
how many guns are stolen from people in your community and then used elsewhere.
if the next mass killer is even now quietly (and legally) stockpiling ammunition and weapons down the street from you.
if you're a statistical anomaly - read any independent report - the US has many many times more gun killings than any other developed nation but, of course, those killings are not going to be evenly spread through every town and street. |
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06/19/2015 12:42:07 PM · #90 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
i agree but in the mean time its still a place to focus. |
So, focus on what's sensationalized instead of what the real problems are...makes sense to me. It's like buying a car covered in rust, with the windows busted out and 4 bald, flat tires that runs on 3 cylinders because you like blue. |
you could make that same argument for gun ownership. why do people want guns when most will never ever have to use one? |
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06/19/2015 12:43:45 PM · #91 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by chazoe:
I live in a small town in Western Colorado, our murder rate is essentially non existent and our gun ownership rate is through the roof. |
interestingly if gun ownership wasn't through the roof, you'd still have essentially a non-existent murder rate. |
If we lived in magic fairy land, we could all ride unicorns and eat magic beans |
only us that are white, they'd lock up the rest for some reason. |
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06/19/2015 12:44:09 PM · #92 |
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
i agree but in the mean time its still a place to focus. |
So, focus on what's sensationalized instead of what the real problems are...makes sense to me. It's like buying a car covered in rust, with the windows busted out and 4 bald, flat tires that runs on 3 cylinders because you like blue. |
you could make that same argument for gun ownership. why do people want guns when most will never ever have to use one? |
Your willfully ignorant assumption is that gun ownership is solely for killing. |
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06/19/2015 12:45:58 PM · #93 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
I love when you get involved in these discussions and I hope the thread doesn't get closed because of ranting. but I honestly don't understand this point. If I have a gun (not you, or anybody else, just me personally) and I get rid of it. Isn't the world a safer place? if only by a tiny, tiny amount? Unless I'm a soldier or a law enforcement agent or a gangster, it must be the case that there is a tiny percentage amount negative change in the potential of gun death? |
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06/19/2015 12:50:14 PM · #94 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
i agree but in the mean time its still a place to focus. |
So, focus on what's sensationalized instead of what the real problems are...makes sense to me. It's like buying a car covered in rust, with the windows busted out and 4 bald, flat tires that runs on 3 cylinders because you like blue. |
you could make that same argument for gun ownership. why do people want guns when most will never ever have to use one? |
Your willfully ignorant assumption is that gun ownership is solely for killing. |
well i guess you could use it as a hammer or hang it on the wall, i'm pretty damned sure if i ever fire a gun (besides practice), its going to kill someone or something. |
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06/19/2015 12:59:51 PM · #95 |
Originally posted by ray_mefarso:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
I love when you get involved in these discussions and I hope the thread doesn't get closed because of ranting. but I honestly don't understand this point. If I have a gun (not you, or anybody else, just me personally) and I get rid of it. Isn't the world a safer place? if only by a tiny, tiny amount? Unless I'm a soldier or a law enforcement agent or a gangster, it must be the case that there is a tiny percentage amount negative change in the potential of gun death? |
It's simple, since you can't seem to think beyond the latest sensational event, I'll explain. As a percentage of preventable deaths, gun homicides represent a miniscule percentage of that overall number. If you're really interested in reducing such deaths, the place to focus is NOT on guns but on things like automobiles, obesity, smoking. You're clearly not interested in that, but rather in carrying on about guns, so babble on, please. |
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06/19/2015 01:06:49 PM · #96 |
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by Mike:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
i agree but in the mean time its still a place to focus. |
So, focus on what's sensationalized instead of what the real problems are...makes sense to me. It's like buying a car covered in rust, with the windows busted out and 4 bald, flat tires that runs on 3 cylinders because you like blue. |
you could make that same argument for gun ownership. why do people want guns when most will never ever have to use one? |
Your willfully ignorant assumption is that gun ownership is solely for killing. |
well i guess you could use it as a hammer or hang it on the wall, i'm pretty damned sure if i ever fire a gun (besides practice), its going to kill someone or something. |
So, unless you're a rabid PETA-type, I'll go ahead and assume that you're OK with killing animals. You may be wealthy enough that you don't need or want to do it yourself, but that doesn't make you any less complicit in those killings than the person getting the blood on their hands.
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06/19/2015 01:09:51 PM · #97 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by ray_mefarso:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
I love when you get involved in these discussions and I hope the thread doesn't get closed because of ranting. but I honestly don't understand this point. If I have a gun (not you, or anybody else, just me personally) and I get rid of it. Isn't the world a safer place? if only by a tiny, tiny amount? Unless I'm a soldier or a law enforcement agent or a gangster, it must be the case that there is a tiny percentage amount negative change in the potential of gun death? |
It's simple, since you can't seem to think beyond the latest sensational event, I'll explain. As a percentage of preventable deaths, gun homicides represent a miniscule percentage of that overall number. If you're really interested in reducing such deaths, the place to focus is NOT on guns but on things like automobiles, obesity, smoking. You're clearly not interested in that, but rather in carrying on about guns, so babble on, please. |
thank you for letting me babble on.
so, if I have it correct, you're saying that the number of gun homicide deaths in the US (despite it being between 6 and 10 times higher than other developed nations) is acceptable because it is less than deaths by other causes? And, therefore, people shouldn't speak about it?
and you give as an example automobile deaths? but these are, in the vast majority, accidents. Accidents that whole industries and researchers and doctors etc. do everything to prevent. To reduce the danger that cars cause is the target of billions of dollars of expenditure. In the case of gun killings are you saying because the numbers are relatively small that no attempt should be made to reduce them? |
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06/19/2015 01:13:12 PM · #98 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
OK... Obama care it is then right? That should be a great preventive mechanism to reduce preventable and possibly fatal diseases. :O)
Ray |
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06/19/2015 01:15:22 PM · #99 |
| I think he was equating cupcakes to guns. |
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06/19/2015 01:23:34 PM · #100 |
Originally posted by ray_mefarso:
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by ray_mefarso:
Originally posted by Spork99:
If you're really interested in saving lives, guns are a poor place to focus. |
I love when you get involved in these discussions and I hope the thread doesn't get closed because of ranting. but I honestly don't understand this point. If I have a gun (not you, or anybody else, just me personally) and I get rid of it. Isn't the world a safer place? if only by a tiny, tiny amount? Unless I'm a soldier or a law enforcement agent or a gangster, it must be the case that there is a tiny percentage amount negative change in the potential of gun death? |
It's simple, since you can't seem to think beyond the latest sensational event, I'll explain. As a percentage of preventable deaths, gun homicides represent a miniscule percentage of that overall number. If you're really interested in reducing such deaths, the place to focus is NOT on guns but on things like automobiles, obesity, smoking. You're clearly not interested in that, but rather in carrying on about guns, so babble on, please. |
thank you for letting me babble on.
so, if I have it correct, you're saying that the number of gun homicide deaths in the US (despite it being between 6 and 10 times higher than other developed nations) is acceptable because it is less than deaths by other causes? And, therefore, people shouldn't speak about it?
and you give as an example automobile deaths? but these are, in the vast majority, accidents. Accidents that whole industries and researchers and doctors etc. do everything to prevent. To reduce the danger that cars cause is the target of billions of dollars of expenditure. In the case of gun killings are you saying because the numbers are relatively small that no attempt should be made to reduce them? |
To put it in perspective, in the US, there were less than 9000 gun homicides (that's ALL instances where a person was killed with a gun, including those that were justified as in self defense or by law enforcement). In contrast, the top 10 causes of accidental death killed a total of just over 1.9 million people (Homicide didn't make the top 10). It's simple math to see how insignificant gun homicides are in the overall picture. Again, if you're really concerned about reducing accidental deaths, focusing on guns is like going after a handful of pennies buried under a pile of $100 bills. Instead, you're focused on the sensational spectacle of these deaths. |
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