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DPChallenge Forums >> Photography Discussion >> No wonder! Mac users are seeing things all wrong!
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10/26/2004 07:31:17 PM · #1
I found this on smugmug.com...

"Why are Macs bright and PCs dark?

Macs come with a default gamma (brightness) setting of 1.8, whereas PCs are set to 2.2 (darker). The reason is the heritage of the Mac: pre-press production for such things as magazines, where the standard is 1.8.

Unfortunately, the standard for the web is 2.2. So unless you set your Mac monitor for 2.2 (the TV setting), images that look correct on a PC will look washed out on a Mac. And images adjusted for a Mac will look too dark on a PC. Read it and weep."

This makes me wonder how many times my photos have been voted down just because you Mac wienies can't see straight. 8-)

10/26/2004 07:39:27 PM · #2
Right, Macs are the graphics standard, so they should change their settings ...
10/26/2004 08:18:30 PM · #3
I would venture a guess that PC users outnumber Mac users 100:1 or better.
Despite the claims of the Mac's superiority at graphics processing, I believe that the differences are insignificant and that PCs should and will become the defacto standard.
10/26/2004 08:27:01 PM · #4
Originally posted by ElGordo:

I would venture a guess that PC users outnumber Mac users 100:1 or better.
Despite the claims of the Mac's superiority at graphics processing, I believe that the differences are insignificant and that PCs should and will become the defacto standard.


I would venture a guess that Chevy drivers outnumber Rolls Royce drivers 1.000.000:1 or better.
Despite the claims of Rolls Royce's superiority and the insignificant difference in price, Chevys shouldn't but are the de facto standard in rural America and a number of Dutch colonies.
10/26/2004 08:34:57 PM · #5
don't you mean 'significant difference in price' ? :)
10/26/2004 08:36:26 PM · #6
Originally posted by magnetic9999:

don't you mean 'significant difference in price' ? :)


No, I meant 'insignificant'.
10/26/2004 08:55:39 PM · #7
2004 Rolls-Royce Phantom $320,000 USD msrp
2004 Chevrolet Impala, loaded $27,995 USD msrp

insignificant...right.
10/26/2004 09:00:00 PM · #8
Those dim monitors are just one more way for PC users to remain in the dark. ;-)
10/26/2004 09:00:21 PM · #9
mac user here... you can set your gamma whatever thingie to 2.2. :) i did. granted, i don't use my mac for print pre-press or anything. :)
10/26/2004 09:12:25 PM · #10
Mac user here, tell me, do these photos look OK on your PC? or are they all to dark?



I'm sure other mac users can provide photos that look good on both a PC and a Mac and vice-versa

Maybe it's the settings on your monitor?



Message edited by author 2004-10-26 21:13:30.
10/26/2004 09:52:33 PM · #11
Eric, your photos look great on my monitor (PC user). Maybe DPC could develop a monitor calibration image that all users could access to set up thier monitors to a common standard. It might not be perfect but it would provide some semblence of a standard for DPC users.
10/26/2004 10:00:07 PM · #12
Originally posted by ericlimon:

Maybe it's the settings on your monitor?

You're missing the point. If you read the article you'll see that it's the Mac users that need to adjust their monitors. Macs come with a default gamma setting of 1.8, and the standard for the web is 2.2.

As for your photos, they look okay to me. However, if your monitor's gamma is set at 1.8, then I'm probably not seeing them with the same colors that you are seeing. How would I know if they're too dark?

The morale of the story is that you poor misguided Mac users aren't seeing what us more knowledgeable PC users intend for you to see. Therefore, you may be unjustly marking down photos simply because your maladjusted equipment is displaying the photos incorrectly.

Your post seems to indicate that you think the gamma settings make no difference--that a photo edited on a Mac with a gamma of 1.8 would look the same on a PC with a gamma of 2.2. If so, would you care to tell us why you believe that?

BTW, my anti-Mac comments are meant in fun. I think Macs are fine machines. I develop software for both platforms, although much more for PCs because the market is what it is.

10/26/2004 10:35:09 PM · #13
Originally posted by annasense:

mac user here... you can set your gamma whatever thingie to 2.2. :) i did. granted, i don't use my mac for print pre-press or anything. :)


When I visit my parents and use my mom's Mac, I set the gamma to 2.2. When I'm using my PC at home to process images for the web, I use the "Save for web" function of Photoshop Elements, which has the ability to preview what the image looks like on both PC and Mac screens. If the Mac version seems too washed out, I'll darken it to try to make it look nice on either system. (But there are more PC's than Macs, so I'll lean towards that platform if I can't make it look good on both.)

Interestingly, prints using my Epson Stylus C82 printer look best when I set the gamma in its driver to 1.8. My prints were consistently too dark until I discovered this trick.
10/26/2004 10:44:40 PM · #14
Originally posted by micknewton:

...you poor misguided Mac users aren't seeing what us more knowledgeable PC users intend for you to see.


BWAHAHAHAHAH...SNICKER..GIGGLE [wiping tears away]...HAHAHAHA! A photo edited using a Mac's default gamma and Photoshop's Monitor RGB proof setting won't look any different on a PC... aside from the fact that cheap, low-quality PCs are often mated to cheap, low-quality monitors. A side-by-side comparison with similar monitors is all the proof you need. Everyone's monitor should be adjusted for optimal display, and calibration guide is already provided as a series of grayscale swatches at the bottom of each voting page.

I'd be willing to bet that the percentage of paid members using a Mac on this site is considerably higher than the population at large. Many commercial photographers use Macs simply because the end result is the same as graphic designers (reproduction on a printing press), and don't forget that Photoshop was originally for the Mac.
10/26/2004 10:45:45 PM · #15
They don't call Windows "The Dark Side" for nothing. ;-)
10/26/2004 10:47:19 PM · #16
Originally posted by scalvert:

They don't call Windows "The Dark Side" for nothing. ;-)


LOL
10/26/2004 10:49:01 PM · #17
oK. well, i believe the difference in price to be very significant, and I think you are in the total minority if you believe otherwise.

Originally posted by zeuszen:

Originally posted by magnetic9999:

don't you mean 'significant difference in price' ? :)


No, I meant 'insignificant'.
10/26/2004 11:04:13 PM · #18
Originally posted by magnetic9999:

oK. well, i believe the difference in price to be very significant, and I think you are in the total minority if you believe otherwise.

Originally posted by zeuszen:

Originally posted by magnetic9999:

don't you mean 'significant difference in price' ? :)


No, I meant 'insignificant'.


I can't believe I need to point this out, but the disparity, actually, was my jest.
10/26/2004 11:11:57 PM · #19
Originally posted by micknewton:

This makes me wonder how many times my photos have been voted down just because you Mac wienies can't see straight. 8-)


Love Muffin, I don't vote down photos because they are too bright or too dark; I take into account that getting a PC to work much less calibrating to any standard is a feet that usually requires holy intervention. I vote down photos because they are... well... bad. :-)
10/26/2004 11:19:16 PM · #20
I think PC users just enjoy downloading a new security patch every other day from microsoft.
10/26/2004 11:38:17 PM · #21
ElGordo 7 other anti-mac photograhers,

Macs hold 7% market share which is quite alot more than 100:1. Web design market share is close to 40%. Pre-press work is closer to 75%. And Apple's apple share is growing. No, I wouldn't buy a mac just to run a grocery store, manage a mutual fund, or run a CNC lathe, but that is not we are talking about, are we? What we are talking about is tools. A computer is a tool, just like a camera system, tripod or any other photographic instrument to make an image. Use what you like and let other do what they want. I personally use a mac, so what. I'm amazed how PC users (microsoft butt kissers) are so afraid of macs that they have to degrade them every chance they get
10/26/2004 11:42:48 PM · #22
my dad is a graphic designer so i grew up on mac. (and am typing on one now) for along time they have been industry standered for the graphic arts also for printing so i have been awhare of the diff. in display but i don't think it makes much of a diff. in my voting.

although gaming is sooo very much better on a mac.

also if your shot is darkish then your shot is darkish or if you your shot is to light the same applies
its just the way it is. i have seen my shots on my friends PC and there is a small but over lookable diff.
just keep the whole thing in mind (when voting) and it doesn't need to be a prob.[voting should be for content 1st and everything 2nd]

thats all,
_Brando_
Mac.'s are superior when it comes to the arts (and everything elce)
10/27/2004 12:21:57 AM · #23
Everyone just set the damn gamma to 2.0 and be done with it. Problem solved!
I hardware calibrated my G5 to 2.0 with an iOne, so I have a happy median. I want them to look good when printed on my printer and when I post to here.
Oh yeah...Apple since '82!

Message edited by author 2004-10-27 00:22:23.
10/27/2004 12:27:54 AM · #24
Originally posted by zeuszen:

Originally posted by ElGordo:

I would venture a guess that PC users outnumber Mac users 100:1 or better.
Despite the claims of the Mac's superiority at graphics processing, I believe that the differences are insignificant and that PCs should and will become the defacto standard.


I would venture a guess that Chevy drivers outnumber Rolls Royce drivers 1.000.000:1 or better.
Despite the claims of Rolls Royce's superiority and the insignificant difference in price, Chevys shouldn't but are the de facto standard in rural America and a number of Dutch colonies.


hehehe
10/27/2004 01:27:13 AM · #25
Just a little video for the PC users, like me, to get an feel for The Mac Experience.

David
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