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DPChallenge Forums >> Individual Photograph Discussion >> Did this image really deserve the score it got?
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 10/24/2007 06:52:31 AM · #1


Just need some feedback. I was expecting perhaps a 5.5 or 5.6, but just scraping past a 5? Was it really that horrible? What did I do wrong? I have seen other images like this that have gotten 90%? What was so bad with this one? What are you seeing? Is it my screen or processing? Is it weird colors or badly focused? I got no helpful comment on this. Nothing to indicate the score it got.

Message edited by author 2007-10-24 14:46:06.
 10/24/2007 06:56:58 AM · #2
well....it kinda takes my appetite away. the angle is rather odd, plus it looks like a harsh flash. my vote would also have been around 4-ish. sorry....
 10/24/2007 06:57:20 AM · #3
It will probably help to post one of the 90% ones you are talking about so we can directly compare and help you to understand. At the moment all I can say is that:
a) Its a bit gross with the gunky food
b) The crop is awkward being too close to the eye and too cramped overall
c) Didn't really meet the challenge in my eyes
d) Yellow colour cast suggests white-balance problems
 10/24/2007 06:58:31 AM · #4
I dont mind the picture. I dont like the food around the mouth but it fits with the picutre and the theme.....just doesn't look good. Maybe people didn't think far enough about the point of view theme.
We think it looks a bit yuk but from a duck point of view it is yum. Sometimes even though it's fitting, it's not always the best choice. I dont think it should have scored that low regardless.
 10/24/2007 07:00:17 AM · #5
konador Here is one of mine that hit the 89% you may use for comparison.

10/24/2007 07:04:55 AM · #6
So then if I had taken just a simple shot of the goose with no food (I had one) with no tongue action (did you miss that additional difficult timing item) then it would have gotten a much higher score?
I had hoped that folks would see the humor of the whole shot. It was a funny shot. That was why I used it.

Message edited by author 2007-10-24 07:06:28.
 10/24/2007 07:12:18 AM · #7
It's not the tongue or the food that dropped your score in this challenge in my eyes. It was that the challenge was not met, this was about finding a different and interesting point of view to add interest to your subject. This seems like a rather standard farm yard shot to me.
 10/24/2007 07:20:04 AM · #8


Okay, so here's how I'd compare them to try and explain the score difference:

Clearly meets red challenge ||| Struggles to meet PoV challenge
Well padded composition ||| Awkward tight crop leaves no space for the viewer except on the right, which looks unbalanced
Good accurate colour tones ||| Yellow cast evident
Nice DoF to separate the subject from the background ||| Just a boring black background with one distracting line
Nice natural lighting shows off all the detail ||| Lighting seems harsh and much detail is lost
Clever and humorous title ||| Bit of a cheesy title to be honest
Nice angle, 45 degrees, works well to show all aspects of the head ||| Angle directly from the side makes it seem very flat (especially with the lighting)
No gross food ||| Gross food

That's why there is a big difference in score in my opinion. The high scoring one just looks so much nicer.

10/24/2007 07:21:13 AM · #9
All right, enough. I obviously took a shot that got the score it deserved because it wasn't "unique." I am sorry to have brought it up. Thanks for those who have tried to help.

I am hoping after this I can finally totally remove myself from here. I have tried losing the addiction and I think this will finally do it for me. It has proven that I have a real twisted view of photography, and my scores from past challenges really show that. My scoring of challenge entries also prove that I haven't got a clue because most of the time I score the lower overall 30% in the upper 20% as far as my votes go. So since I seem to have a different view of photography which is way different from the majority here, then I cannot expect to choose entries that will do well. My votes and what I value and vote on are just way too different from the majority of voters here.

I cannot cut it, I have never been able to with this group, and I guess that my struggle to excell will never go anywhere. You can't excell if you don't got it, and I don't got it. Thanks to friends from the past. It is time to take the bookmark off for the site.

Message edited by author 2007-10-24 07:30:24.
 10/24/2007 07:34:12 AM · #10
Thanks for posting this thread. I know (trust me) how frustrating it is when a photo you think is really nice does very poorly. Konador's response was helpful for me, so you've given others the opportunity to learn from your situation, as well as getting (from an outsider's point of view) some good advice. Most of the items Konador mentioned are things you can control and improve on in future shots.
 10/24/2007 07:39:45 AM · #11
remember... its not about getting the high score, or winning ribbons....its about the joy of photography, and learning and growing as a photographer... that is why a lot of people are here. A lot of the ribbon winners were once at my level, or yours.... this site really helps us learn about all aspects of the art of photography.

I just learned somethng from this post!

Message edited by author 2007-10-24 07:41:18.
 10/24/2007 07:44:00 AM · #12
ITS MY BALL AND IF I CANT WIN I AINT PLAYING ANYMORE...

Keep on trying, thats all I can say, hook up with a mentor as mentioned in a thread from last week, ask them to guide you through whats good/bad indifferent about your shot.

Stamping your feet and saying you're leaving will not help your photography either..

Saying that, if you are leaving then goodbye.

EDIT - Just checked out your profile, you have some reasonable scores in there.. some people on this site, who have fought tooth and nail to improve theirs scores and would give their right arm for a score just to reach the 6s, they just keep trying.. I prefer triers to quitters.. I think a prime example is Sherpet, she has been trying for ages and ages, against a backdrop of personal health and other issues she has come close several times but never won a ribbon.. today her patience and persistance have paid off.. But never once (from what I recall) did she moan about it. Maybe you should take a leaf out of her book.

Originally posted by JunieMoon:
All right, enough. I obviously took a shot that got

the score it deserved because it wasn't "unique." I am sorry to have brought it up. Thanks for those who have tried to help.

I am hoping after this I can finally totally remove myself from here. I have tried losing the addiction and I think this will finally do it for me. It has proven that I have a real twisted view of photography, and my scores from past challenges really show that. My scoring of challenge entries also prove that I haven't got a clue because most of the time I score the lower overall 30% in the upper 20% as far as my votes go. So since I seem to have a different view of photography which is way different from the majority here, then I cannot expect to choose entries that will do well. My votes and what I value and vote on are just way too different from the majority of voters here.

I cannot cut it, I have never been able to with this group, and I guess that my struggle to excell will never go anywhere. You can't excell if you don't got it, and I don't got it. Thanks to friends from the past. It is time to take the bookmark off for the site.


Message edited by author 2007-10-24 07:49:13.
 10/24/2007 07:49:33 AM · #13
June, I cant understand your comments. I've looked at your photos and they are good and you would have to know they are good, so I dont even need to encourage you. If I compare my stuff to yours your are way ahead. So why the 'my photos aren't good enough for this site' attitude? I dont know you well enough but are you trying to tell me that you never learned anything from DPC that that you have applied in your photos/photography?

I suggest sleep on it and see how you feel in the morning.
 10/24/2007 08:03:11 AM · #14
If you ask for feedback you mustn't get offended when people give it to you honestly. A lot of people strive for high scores and ribbons - for me the site is more about learning and improving with the help of a great bunch of people. Try not to get disheartened.
 10/24/2007 09:16:43 AM · #15
You have some nice pictures. Who honestly gives a turd if one of your pictures doesn't do as well as you'd hoped? It happens to EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US (except Scalvert) quite a lot and compared to your highest scoring entries, that shot is quite bad.

What do you want? Validation? Smoke blown up your ass? I've noticed on DPC that rarely do people pull punches and the standard here is incredibly high, which in my view makes DPC all the better for it because if something stinks, they'll tell you it stinks.

But hey, you have your own decisions to make and i respect that, I just think it's a silly and petulant reason to remove the bookmark from your browser.
 10/24/2007 10:10:32 AM · #16
Please don't get discouraged !

I was sure this shot below would get a 6+ score...I really did !

10/24/2007 10:16:40 AM · #17
wow, over reacting a bit? You asked why it scored so low, and I think Konodor did an excellent job explaining why.

It's the internet...don't get depressed about it. Learn from what everyone has shared with you and try to apply it to your next challenge entry. And who cares if you score low? It's by failing that we learn how to succeed.

Message edited by author 2007-10-24 10:16:54.
 10/24/2007 10:19:10 AM · #18
Originally posted by JunieMoon:

I am hoping after this I can finally totally remove myself from here. I have tried losing the addiction and I think this will finally do it for me. It has proven that I have a real twisted view of photography, and my scores from past challenges really show that. My scoring of challenge entries also prove that I haven't got a clue because most of the time I score the lower overall 30% in the upper 20% as far as my votes go. So since I seem to have a different view of photography which is way different from the majority here, then I cannot expect to choose entries that will do well. My votes and what I value and vote on are just way too different from the majority of voters here.

I cannot cut it, I have never been able to with this group, and I guess that my struggle to excell will never go anywhere. You can't excell if you don't got it, and I don't got it. Thanks to friends from the past. It is time to take the bookmark off for the site.


This is very hard to swallow. Self pity doesn't benefit you and is particularly hard to buy when you've posted shots like this



That is a world apart from



...and the scores reflect that difference. Are you saying you don't understand why the first would score so much better than the second? You are obviously capable of submitting entries that are well received here. I find it hard to believe you can't provide yourself an honest critique between those two shots, but if not perhaps write down your own ideas on why one did so much better than the other and then bounce them off half a dozen other people to see if they notice things you didn't or are looking at aspects of the shot that aren't immediately obvious to you.
 10/24/2007 10:24:39 AM · #19
I gave it a 5, which was probably a little high. To me the image was not very interesting and the POV was like a snap shot rather than an interesting point of view that added to interest or drama to the photo. I know sometimes I get to close to my shots and really need to step back and look at it with fresh eyes, when I do I ussually say what was I thinking...lol. Hopefully the feedback helps.
 10/24/2007 10:31:59 AM · #20

I am still upset that this finished last place. (well, second last. I beat the phot of a motorcycle in the bicycle challenge)
Yeah its blurry, but i still found it to be more artistic than a bunch of snapshots peopletook of their bikes in their yard.

But, knowing the standards of beauty/appreciation here at dpc, i know why it scored low.

routerguy is right, look at your two photos he posted and the one for geometry. You cant tell me that they are the same?

10/24/2007 11:06:31 AM · #21
Frankly, I actually hated that paper shot. It is actually my least favorite of all my shots I have taken. I actually was going to delete that paper shot an hour before the challenge stopped because I thought it was just too low a quality. Yes, I can honestly say that I cannot see why that shot did so well. It was put on a table, I used flash, and that is it. I actually did compare the two shots and thought the clarity and the color and the detail was just as good on my goose shot. That is why I put it in. I said to myself that it had a lot going for it. That is what I mean. My personal opinions just aren't there. I also loved my stump shot from last year . I thought it was really great and I loved it very much. I am only saying that of 130 challenges only 12 have scored 6 or better. That says something about my general ability. The reality is that I have been told in the past that maybe dp is not the right place for me, and I think I have to agree. I just wrote Simm explaining that I have already had 6 mentors since joining, I have listened and used what has been said in comments, I have applied and done what has been recommended. I have really tried, but it gets to a point when you just got to say that the concept in the photos is really lacking in your own work. There are over 50,000 potential entries a week. I understand this and I am actually glad to be seeing some new faces. Until I can get with right subject, right challenge, right processing, I need to let it be. If I haven't gotten with the program more than not by now, than I can pretty much figure it won't happen.
Originally posted by routerguy666:
Originally posted by JunieMoon:

I am hoping after this I ca[quote=routerguy666] [quote=JunieMoon]
I am hoping after this I can finally totally remove myself from here. I have tried losing the addiction and I think this will finally do it for me. It has proven that I have a real twisted view of photography, and my scores from past challenges really show that. My scoring of challenge entries also prove that I haven't got a clue because most of the time I score the lower overall 30% in the upper 20% as far as my votes go. So since I seem to have a different view of photography which is way different from the majority here, then I cannot expect to choose entries that will do well. My votes and what I value and vote on are just way too different from the majority of voters here.

I cannot cut it, I have never been able to with this group, and I guess that my struggle to excell will never go anywhere. You can't excell if you don't got it, and I don't got it. Thanks to friends from the past. It is time to take the bookmark off for the site.


This is very hard to swallow. Self pity doesn't benefit you and is particularly hard to buy when you've posted shots like this



That is a world apart from



...and the scores reflect that difference. Are you saying you don't understand why the first would score so much better than the second? You are obviously capable of submitting entries that are well received here. I find it hard to believe you can't provide yourself an honest critique between those two shots, but if not perhaps write down your own ideas on why one did so much better than the other and then bounce them off half a dozen other people to see if they notice things you didn't or are looking at aspects of the shot that aren't immediately obvious to you.


Message edited by author 2007-10-24 11:21:20.
 10/24/2007 11:36:49 AM · #22
Every image deserves the score it gets.
 10/24/2007 11:42:42 AM · #23
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Every image deserves the score it gets.


Reminds me of the late John Cage: "Is there too much suffering in the world?" - "No, it's exactly the right amount."
 10/24/2007 12:06:54 PM · #24
Originally posted by Simms:
...hook up with a mentor as mentioned in a thread from last week, ask them to guide you through whats good/bad indifferent about your shot.


Another thing that is incredibly helpful for getting feedback is to enter the side challanges. I've probably learned as much from the side challenges as I have from the main challenges (perhaps more). And the lack of numerical ratings makes me more inclined to try out some new ideas that may or may not work. (BTW, the number of comments tends to taper off towards the end of the month, so I would suggest entering a new side challenge in November rather than entering an October one that is almost over.)
 10/24/2007 12:23:11 PM · #25
I just looked at your challenge entries, and saw some very nice stuff. Keep in mind that this is a tough crowd here, and there are many pros and very advanced amateurs. My own best to date has only done in the high 5's, but over on a Flickr group I belong to, someone declared me one of the "gurus" that could give contructive criticism to others. It's very much a relative thing.

I gave your duck photo a 6, but I do agree that the food around the mouth was a put-off, though I know it was really the point of the image. It's also an average, and even the best entries always seem to have a couple of very low individual ratings. The criteria some people judge by may not be the same as others use.

I am also finding that commenting on and evaluating others photos is a powerful learing tool. I like to go back after the challenge is over and see how my ratings and comments line up with what others have said.

Message edited by author 2007-10-24 12:23:31.
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