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07/29/2005 10:33:34 AM · #76 |
| I'd rather look suspicious in the USA than in London, England right about now. At least they're asking questions in the US before police officers (who are dressed like the average citizen) chase you and shoot you from behind. |
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07/29/2005 11:33:24 AM · #77 |
Originally posted by srbrubaker:
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
The US is at war, so expect to have your credentials scrutinized.
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I'd rather keep my credentials where they belong, if you don't mind.
The Article 1 Section 8 of the US Constitution grants the Congress sole authority to declare war. But it has not done so since the US was involved in WWII. So if the US is at war, then the executive has overreached its authority.
One does not win a war on terror by killing terrorists. Killiing them is the most productive means of turning people who don't like you into suicide bombers. If you don't believe it, think about how many suicide bombers American aggression has produced in Iraq.
Remember the last words of Obi-Wan Kenobi. "kill me and I will come back a hundred times stronger." If one could win the war on terrorism by killing terrorists, things would be different in in Northern Ireland and Israel. And terrorism would end with the first suicide bomber. It is not constraint or force that causes people to lay down their lives for causes in which they believe, It is rage. It is anger. it is hatred, the hatred of people who feel powerless to address injustice. People do not hate gratuitously, they are taught hatred by reasoning about injustice or just by feeling enraged about injustice. Crush al-Qaeda, Crush Hamas, crush every terrorist organization known on this planet and what will happen? Each will be replaced by ten just like it except more powerful, more determined, more efficient.
How does one win with terrorists? One listens to the complaints that give rise to their virulent attitudes. One works for a world that works for everyone, not just the guys with the most resources. It is ears and minds and empathy and a determination to be fair to all people - not just the ones who can afford to hire guys with guns - that will win the war on terrorism. It is to allow people who have complaints to raise them and give them fair hearing. It is to act against injustices when they are raised by people with complaints. This is the ultimate reason for free speech.
As long as Americans believe that the police will 'keep us safe' if we only trade away our civil rights, the terrorists have won. Paraphrazing Ben Franklin "Those who trade away liberty to gain safety deserve neither and lose both."
This has a lot to do with where we are allowed to point our cameras. |
Man, you just described (in much clearer terms than I ever could) what was going through my head after I posted earlier. You have a very valid point.
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07/29/2005 11:42:27 AM · #78 |
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
Originally posted by srbrubaker:
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
The US is at war, so expect to have your credentials scrutinized.
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I'd rather keep my credentials where they belong, if you don't mind.
The Article 1 Section 8 of the US Constitution grants the Congress sole authority to declare war. But it has not done so since the US was involved in WWII. So if the US is at war, then the executive has overreached its authority.
One does not win a war on terror by killing terrorists. Killiing them is the most productive means of turning people who don't like you into suicide bombers. If you don't believe it, think about how many suicide bombers American aggression has produced in Iraq.
Remember the last words of Obi-Wan Kenobi. "kill me and I will come back a hundred times stronger." If one could win the war on terrorism by killing terrorists, things would be different in in Northern Ireland and Israel. And terrorism would end with the first suicide bomber. It is not constraint or force that causes people to lay down their lives for causes in which they believe, It is rage. It is anger. it is hatred, the hatred of people who feel powerless to address injustice. People do not hate gratuitously, they are taught hatred by reasoning about injustice or just by feeling enraged about injustice. Crush al-Qaeda, Crush Hamas, crush every terrorist organization known on this planet and what will happen? Each will be replaced by ten just like it except more powerful, more determined, more efficient.
How does one win with terrorists? One listens to the complaints that give rise to their virulent attitudes. One works for a world that works for everyone, not just the guys with the most resources. It is ears and minds and empathy and a determination to be fair to all people - not just the ones who can afford to hire guys with guns - that will win the war on terrorism. It is to allow people who have complaints to raise them and give them fair hearing. It is to act against injustices when they are raised by people with complaints. This is the ultimate reason for free speech.
As long as Americans believe that the police will 'keep us safe' if we only trade away our civil rights, the terrorists have won. Paraphrazing Ben Franklin "Those who trade away liberty to gain safety deserve neither and lose both."
This has a lot to do with where we are allowed to point our cameras. |
Man, you just described (in much clearer terms than I ever could) what was going through my head after I posted earlier. You have a very valid point. |
I agree.
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07/29/2005 01:44:44 PM · #79 |
Originally posted by srbrubaker:
How does one win with terrorists? One listens to the complaints that give rise to their virulent attitudes. One works for a world that works for everyone, not just the guys with the most resources. It is ears and minds and empathy and a determination to be fair to all people - not just the ones who can afford to hire guys with guns - that will win the war on terrorism. It is to allow people who have complaints to raise them and give them fair hearing. It is to act against injustices when they are raised by people with complaints. This is the ultimate reason for free speech. |
Personally, I'd rather explain myself to a cop when taking photos then watch my country give in to terrorist demands.
Your thought sounds great in theory, but it is impossible to create a world that works for everyone and life is fair to all people. Impossible. People are different. Difference makes the world great, but also makes it a horrible place as what is fair and works for me is a 180 degree opposite to what people on the other side of the world consider fair.
Also, someone willing to strap explosives to their ass and walk into a crowded bus can not be reasoned with. If you are capable of doing something like that, things that should be in your brain are missing. At that point you are a rabid pitbull and there is only one way to deal with you.
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07/29/2005 02:09:07 PM · #80 |
Bottom line is where is there any criminal justice evidence that stopping photographers for identification has stopped any kind of terrorist activity? The only thing that does is make those photographers apprehensive about photographing in the future and stopping truth from coming out. I'm sure the higher ups in the Bush administration had preferred that cameras not have been used to document the abuses at Abu Ghraib (well actually, there were a tool of abuse).
There is no way to stop all of the tourist photographers in NYC, for instance. Go any day of the week to see how many people are photographing landmarks in NY and you will see this is a ludicrous policy by the authorities. I"m sure they number in the 10s of thousands. In fact, stupid stops like what Neil had to go through with no real suspicion of crime take away valuable police resources to stopping other crimes and criminals. I'm more worried about getting hit by a speeding driver than I am about being caught in a terrorist attack.
Message edited by author 2005-07-29 14:14:51. |
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07/29/2005 02:21:52 PM · #81 |
having a cop looking at your ID does absolutely nothing, so I dont see why i need to show it to him. One of the hijackers for the 9/11 attacks was stopped by the police. Funny thing is this guy was on the terrorist watch list. Some how he still made it to the airport and got on the plane, and we all know the rest of the story.
This happened because local/state and federal databases are not always available to all law enforcement. Since 9/11 I do beleive that they are trying to improve cross department data base access.
if the cop DOES NOT check you out in the system right then and there what good is it going to do. NONE, so I dont think I need to show my ID just so he can look at my name, address and a crappy DMV photo, just because I was taking a photo.
James |
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