Continuous Lighting or Strobe - DPChallenge Forums

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Pentax

09/18/2004 03:04:13 PM · #5

I'd like to ring in on this, this is 2004 and there are a lot of alternatives to strobs..

575w and 1200w HMI frenels is what I favor, these fixtures are 5600K, deliver extreme output and are much cooler than "hotlights", there are also totaly focusable which helps in creating mood. The downside to this is cost, a 575w frenel and pack will cost you around 6000$...I have them 'cause I use them for work (I work for as a LD for a production comp.)

The second and massively popular source of lighting is Neon, Companies like KinoFlow and Brightline manufacture Lights using film grade neons that produce about the same output as a 400W strob...and use almost no power. The upside, is that these lights are soft enough to use without diffusion and that they will give you the oportunity to use your camera's metering system. The tubes are also available in 3200K, 5600K and 7000K so you can balance your lightsources with your ambiant light.

I've even seen some renound fashion photographers use film grade Neons on regular "garage" 4 tube fixtures... the tubes cost about 50$ each..and the box would cost you about 40$...so for 250$ you have an awsome softlight that will work magic for portrait.

Voila!

Message edited by author 2004-09-18 15:07:07.

kyebosh

Canon EOS-20D

Canon EF 80-200mm f/2.8L

09/18/2004 03:06:36 PM · #6

erm, anything more in the range of a college student budget?

Artyste

Sony Ericsson W810i

09/18/2004 03:19:26 PM · #7

I need budget strobe lighting myself.. and I'd love to find something that will work with the Fuji Finepix S7000...
I can't find *anything* about it on the net.. AARGGH.. and we don't have a camera shop in my city that knows *anything* about digital cameras or what lighting options I have.

Very frustrating. So anyway, until I find out more about my camera and strobe lights.. I'm heading to Wal-Mart to pick up some work lamps, and do what I can with continuous lighting...

16point2mm

Sigma SD9

Sigma 28-80mm f/3.5-5.6 Aspherical HF for Sigma

09/18/2004 03:42:42 PM · #8

Must say, this has been a hot topic for a few of us down this way, too. I for one like to spend more time working with my model on posing, expression, etc than taking the time to guess at the effect the strobe is going to have. Sure, I've got instant feedback with my camera's LCD, but to be honest, I can set continuous lights in less than a minute, whereas it's back & forth between my model, my backdrop, and my strobes if I use those. I find it more of a headache.

That said, to date I've only had higher temperature continuous sources to work with (halogens, HMI's, and upper-end incandescents) regularly. Of the lot, I prefer the incandescents once softened with muslin screens. But I've been looking at a lot of the flourescent setups now, too. They're easilly color corrected to damn near anything before the sensor, they run very cool, and they're pretty darned soft to start with. Now I've managed to find a severe downside to every set of lights I've worked with to date; what am I missing with flourescents? There has to be a major problem that's just not showing itself to me! Would love to hear opinions!

Message edited by author 2004-09-18 15:43:40.

smokeditor

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

09/18/2004 03:49:04 PM · #9

i dont think you can beat the Alien Bee B400 for price and features for a starter strobe. Alien Bees
For $225 you get alot in a small package.

09/18/2004 04:10:43 PM · #10

Originally posted by 16point2mm:

well you haven't notice the Green overtones that can't be corrected yet then!

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

09/18/2004 04:11:33 PM · #11

Originally posted by smokeditor:

i dont think you can beat the Alien Bee B400 for price and features for a starter strobe. Alien Bees
For $225 you get alot in a small package.

Problem with "lower end" falshes is that they won't always fire at the same level and that can be an issue.

Travis99

Canon EOS-5D

09/18/2004 05:26:17 PM · #12

Could i get two more sb-600's and add them to the one i have. would that be good?

16point2mm

Sigma SD9

Sigma 28-80mm f/3.5-5.6 Aspherical HF for Sigma

09/18/2004 06:27:55 PM · #13

Originally posted by Gil P:

Originally posted by 16point2mm:
That said, to date I've only had higher temperature continuous sources to work with (halogens, HMI's, and upper-end incandescents) regularly. {snip} But I've been looking at a lot of the flourescent setups now, too. They're easilly color corrected to damn near anything before the sensor, they run very cool, and they're pretty darned soft to start with.

well you haven't notice the Green overtones that can't be corrected yet then!

Umm, well, no. If you're referring to the flourescents, you'll notice from the quoted post, I haven't shot with them, so I obviously haven't had opportunity to "notice the Green overtones". And "can't be corrected?" I won't completely disregard that, but between good, proper gelling and a competant Photoshop editing session, I find it really difficult to believe that such a basic white balance can't be fixed. By all means, I would love to hear a better, more expansive explaination on your meaning here.

DarkRider

Nikon D300

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5G IF-ED

09/18/2004 06:45:24 PM · #14

Originally posted by Travis99:

Could i get two more sb-600's and add them to the one i have. would that be good?

Thats my plan 2 SB600 and a SB800 to control them...you need to have the 800 to control the 600(s) in i-TTL mode.

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

09/18/2004 07:13:01 PM · #15

Originally posted by 16point2mm:

Originally posted by Gil P:

Originally posted by 16point2mm:
That said, to date I've only had higher temperature continuous sources to work with (halogens, HMI's, and upper-end incandescents) regularly. {snip} But I've been looking at a lot of the flourescent setups now, too. They're easilly color corrected to damn near anything before the sensor, they run very cool, and they're pretty darned soft to start with.

well you haven't notice the Green overtones that can't be corrected yet then!

Umm, well, no. If you're referring to the flourescents, you'll notice from the quoted post, I haven't shot with them, so I obviously haven't had opportunity to "notice the Green overtones". And "can't be corrected?" I won't completely disregard that, but between good, proper gelling and a competant Photoshop editing session, I find it really difficult to believe that such a basic white balance can't be fixed. By all means, I would love to hear a better, more expansive explaination on your meaning here.

The problem with Fluorescents is that they are emiting light at a certain coler temp (lets say 6000K) while at the same time emitting another frequency of light in the green spectrum, so if you color corect in Post, you shift the spectrum of the other colors around. HOWEVER there are Fluorenscent tubes thare are designed for film/photo that have a "minus" green coating on them to remove the green overtones..obviously those are fairly more expensive (around 75$ per tube). you can check out these manufacturers: KinoFlow and Brightline.

graphicfunk

Canon EOS-20D

09/18/2004 07:36:24 PM · #16

My advise is to first learn to work with hot lights. Strobe present many problems for the novice but are great once the basics have been mastered with hot lights.

Yes, strobe may have modeling lights, but these are hard to read. Of course, if you use umbrellas with strobe then you are at the mercy of eye-balling.

Hot lights give you the ultimate control because what you see is what you get and often a minor adjustment is required such as to clear a shadow away from a lip or an eye.

Once you understand the proper placement, then strobes is a more convenient way to go.

Spork99

Canon EOS M6 Mk II

Canon EF-M 22mm f/2.0 STM Lens

09/18/2004 09:18:03 PM · #17

Originally posted by Gil P:

Originally posted by 16point2mm:

Originally posted by Gil P:

Originally posted by 16point2mm:
That said, to date I've only had higher temperature continuous sources to work with (halogens, HMI's, and upper-end incandescents) regularly. {snip} But I've been looking at a lot of the flourescent setups now, too. They're easilly color corrected to damn near anything before the sensor, they run very cool, and they're pretty darned soft to start with.

well you haven't notice the Green overtones that can't be corrected yet then!

Umm, well, no. If you're referring to the flourescents, you'll notice from the quoted post, I haven't shot with them, so I obviously haven't had opportunity to "notice the Green overtones". And "can't be corrected?" I won't completely disregard that, but between good, proper gelling and a competant Photoshop editing session, I find it really difficult to believe that such a basic white balance can't be fixed. By all means, I would love to hear a better, more expansive explaination on your meaning here.

The problem with Fluorescents is that they are emiting light at a certain coler temp (lets say 6000K) while at the same time emitting another frequency of light in the green spectrum, so if you color corect in Post, you shift the spectrum of the other colors around. HOWEVER there are Fluorenscent tubes thare are designed for film/photo that have a "minus" green coating on them to remove the green overtones..obviously those are fairly more expensive (around 75$ per tube). you can check out these manufacturers: KinoFlow and Brightline.

I'm not as familiar with the photo flourescents as I could be, but I do know that some flourescent bulbs are not continuous spectrum lights. That is, they don't emit light at certain parts of the visible spectrum.

16point2mm

Sigma SD9

Sigma 28-80mm f/3.5-5.6 Aspherical HF for Sigma

09/18/2004 10:10:37 PM · #18

Originally posted by Spazmo99:

Originally posted by Gil P:
The problem with Fluorescents is that they are emiting light at a certain coler temp (lets say 6000K) while at the same time emitting another frequency of light in the green spectrum, so if you color corect in Post, you shift the spectrum of the other colors around. HOWEVER there are Fluorenscent tubes thare are designed for film/photo that have a "minus" green coating on them to remove the green overtones..obviously those are fairly more expensive (around 75$ per tube). you can check out these manufacturers: KinoFlow and Brightline.

I'm not as familiar with the photo flourescents as I could be, but I do know that some flourescent bulbs are not continuous spectrum lights. That is, they don't emit light at certain parts of the visible spectrum.

Gil, thanks for the broader explaination. It's much appreciated. It is actually possible, especially working from RAW mode, to do seperated curves/level adjustments like those in Photoshop, but it's far from fun. Minus green (usually 1/3 step) lighting gels (at $7/sheet) take care of the green spectrum issues you're talking about without much issue. Plus, minus green 50mm filters are pretty darn cheap (<$20), even for the good ones. I've even gotten some good results from mine while shooting certain colors until HMI's, but that's a completely different application! Still worth mentioning, since it's a bear to tackle this type of thing if one is not quite as well versed in color correction.

Spazmo, you're certainly correct in that most of the average hardware store flourescents do lack some waves, especially in the red end of the spectrum, but photo flourescents (or these days, more commonly termed video flourescents) are called such for just this reason -- they're either full spectrum, or color corrected in their coatings, typically to daylight.