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07/10/2005 09:33:27 AM · #151 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by deapee:
.... And if another country has a problem with that, then drop the big one on them.
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I sometimes get the impression that if you were in charge Deapee, a significant portion of the world would be one massive parking lot... I could be wrong.
Ray |
No, it wouldn't be...but many people would be afriad to talk smack. Everyone would respect everyone...the world would be a better place.
I SHOULD RUN FOR PRESIDENT!!!
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07/10/2005 09:41:20 AM · #152 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by deapee:
.... And if another country has a problem with that, then drop the big one on them.
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I sometimes get the impression that if you were in charge Deapee, a significant portion of the world would be one massive parking lot... I could be wrong.
Ray |
I am very sad to have read that post. Ruined my morning. It's no wonder a good chunk of the planet hates us.
It's time to turn off(block)this thread.......
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07/10/2005 09:43:46 AM · #153 |
Originally posted by deapee:
oh...that ... and BACK OFF THE US. You say you reserve the right to talk about the US' policies -- you don't have that right. Think what you want, but when you start preaching to hundreds of people about it on the internet, I think you're going overboard. You're insane dude. You live in a country that is too cowardly to back the US up when the US is backing your country up IN THE FIRST PLACE!!! |
Denying the right to free speech? Hardly sounds like the values of the USA to me! Anyone who is affected by the policies of the US has a right to their opinions on those policies and the right to discuss them in political discussions such as this.
Finding what they say unpleasant is your prerogative. Refusing to accept any of it as valid is certainly your prerogative.
But denying their right to expression of those opinions is downright unAmerican.
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07/10/2005 09:52:25 AM · #154 |
It's not unamerican. You are from ENGLAND...what do you know about being an American? How can you tell me what American is and what American isn't? You don't know what I stand for. You don't know what my beliefs are. How are you to tell me I am not being American?
I am not being giving, and kind, and respectful. You're correct. I'm sick of listening to people from other countries bash the US for this or that. Then next week, when a bus blows up 10 of your buildings, ask the US for help...PLEASE!!
I just hate the fact that the US gives and gives and gives, sometimes despite our own needs...just for the rest of the world to hate us.
Oh, and by the way...what I say *is* American, it has to be because I'm an American. If you don't like it, you don't have to listen...and if a person from another country disagrees with that, then so be it! I could care less. Let's talk about the UK's dirty laundry or England's dirty laundry for a change.
Why are there so many people from all around the world that want to get so into the US policies? Why do you care so much? It's not like people from the US are starting threads on your country.
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07/10/2005 09:52:51 AM · #155 |
[quote=deapee]..YOU ARE NOT AN AMERICAN. YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO CRITICIZE THE US OR OUR PRESIDENT.[/b]
I THINK AMERICA IS TOO NICE. I think we're too lenient. I think we let other countries slide too often. I think we should worry about our own backs.
We have thousands of soldiers in Iraq -- to protec the civillians in the long-run. Don't talk about innocent civilians dying, that is a casualty of war...NOT A TERRORIST ATTACK. I agree, we SHOULD NOT be there.
Until we fix the problems INSIDE AMERICA, screw the rest of the world. And if another country has a problem with that, then drop the big one on them.
quote]
I DO NOT believe this post! Deapee you have done more to harm the world's opinion of the US in that one post that anything else that has been said in this thread by either side.
You, someone from the country of free speec, say that legalbeagle hays no RIGHT to criticise the US policies (not the US or its people) because he is not American? Thank God I know enough Americans to not consider you typical.
It's OK to kill people in a war whatever the reason??? Goodbye war crimes it's all justified!
I have no doubt you have problems in the US - every country does -but it doesn't stop those of us with a bit of intelligence being concerned about the bigger (literally) issues called our world, our Earth, our global home.
Your final comment about dropping the "big one on them" sums up your pathetic and immature mindset asyou have obviously no imagination, no exoerience and no knowledge of what "the big one " could do to the world.
Grow UP!
P |
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07/10/2005 09:54:28 AM · #156 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by deapee:
.... And if another country has a problem with that, then drop the big one on them.
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I sometimes get the impression that if you were in charge Deapee, a significant portion of the world would be one massive parking lot... I could be wrong.
Ray |
I am very sad to have read that post. Ruined my morning. It's no wonder a good chunk of the planet hates us.
It's time to turn off(block)this thread....... |
Yep, you hate me because I dislike the rest of the world talking about the US. Dude, go hate the people that are in your backyard killing your friends, your relatives. Hate the people that caused us to send our forces to other countries while we need the help here, ourselves.
Your thinking process seems a bit backwards to me, but that's your perrogative. lol...block the thread? You can't just ... not click on it? You have to block the thread because of one response that I said? Now that's being mature.
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07/10/2005 09:55:28 AM · #157 |
Originally posted by deapee:
It's not unamerican. You are from ENGLAND...what do you know about being an American? How can you tell me what American is and what American isn't? You don't know what I stand for. You don't know what my beliefs are. How are you to tell me I am not being American?
I am not being giving, and kind, and respectful. You're correct. I'm sick of listening to people from other countries bash the US for this or that. Then next week, when a bus blows up 10 of your buildings, ask the US for help...PLEASE!!
I just hate the fact that the US gives and gives and gives, sometimes despite our own needs...just for the rest of the world to hate us.
Oh, and by the way...what I say *is* American, it has to be because I'm an American. If you don't like it, you don't have to listen...and if a person from another country disagrees with that, then so be it! I could care less. Let's talk about the UK's dirty laundry or England's dirty laundry for a change.
Why are there so many people from all around the world that want to get so into the US policies? Why do you care so much? It's not like people from the US are starting threads on your country. |
I'll ignore most of your post since it doesn't strike me as entirely coherent. But I'll answer your question, why do I feel the need to discuss US policies?
Because, however I may feel about it, the USA is currently the world's only superpower. The policies it makes and the actions it takes have a massive impact not just on American lives but on the lives of people all around the world.
Whether you like it or not, get it or not, agree with it or not, that gives me and others all around the world the right to comment.
Message edited by author 2005-07-10 09:56:57.
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07/10/2005 09:56:43 AM · #158 |
Originally posted by Riponlady:
[quote=deapee
Your final comment about dropping the "big one on them" sums up your pathetic and immature mindset asyou have obviously no imagination, no exoerience and no knowledge of what "the big one " could do to the world.
Grow UP!
P |
Can we not personally attack here? If this is allowed now for some reason on these forums, please let me know. I'm just waiting to start attacking some people on a personal level. You're pathetic. Stay outta the US' business.
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07/10/2005 10:00:13 AM · #159 |
Originally posted by Kavey:
Because, however I may feel about it, the USA is currently the world's only superpower. The policies it makes and the actions it takes have a massive impact not just on American lives but on the lives of people all around the world.
Whether you like it or not, get it or not, agree with it or not, that gives me and others all around the world the right to comment. |
You're absolutely correct. The things America chooses to do have impacts on everyone around the world. We are helpful, we are kind, we can be in a deficit, and still give your country money, when we need it here ourselves.
If people from other countries would understand that there are people in America suffering, and without homes, because a lot of our dollars are going to help your countries or other countries (other than ourselves), then I think they wouldn't be so quick to say bad things about the US or its policies.
The US tries to help everyone...and we catch A LOT of slack from all over the world. I say the help is unappreciated. I say we stop helping and worry about our own backs. It seems only right.
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07/10/2005 10:03:07 AM · #160 |
Only the US can decide whether to continue in it's current (self-imposed) role of world policeman or whether to refocus on internal affairs. Until it chooses to do that, the world will continue to comment on what affects it.
However, things aren't as black and white as you'd like to see them and many of those criticising various US policies are, in the main part, big supporters of the US, it's people and its efforts.
That doesn't mean that we will keep our mouths shut about those instances where we are not in agreement.
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07/10/2005 10:03:22 AM · #161 |
//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.php?action=read&FORUM_THREAD_ID=238995
What are we going to do?
Our troops are all across the world helping other countries out, and rebuilding their place of living. Maybe your country can send us some of its troops to help rebuild after this one. Not likely.
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07/10/2005 10:06:34 AM · #162 |
I'm done with this thread.
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07/10/2005 10:07:15 AM · #163 |
Sorry if I offended you deapee( sarcastic in case you didn't realise) but you offended me and every right thinking person reading this thread.! I told you what I thought of your post and ended on how I felt about you - pretty mild considering you basically just told the world to ******* off and don't dare make intelligent comments. Have you read the threads on G8 and previous parts of this one? There has been excellent intelligent debate with fiery words and heated emotions but it has been educational and informative . Yours wasn't!
P |
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07/10/2005 10:08:44 AM · #164 |
Originally posted by deapee:
I'm done with this thread. |
Good! |
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07/10/2005 10:11:26 AM · #165 |
Originally posted by deapee:
Our troops are all across the world helping other countries out, and rebuilding their place of living. Maybe your country can send us some of its troops to help rebuild after this one. Not likely. |
Our troops are currently working with yours as our leader followed yours into those countries. Both our governments have the option of pulling some or all of those troops out.
However, I don't want to get into specifics about my opinions on the war in Iraq, so I'm not going to continue further on that particular line of discussion.
I can see that your opinions are not only diametrically opposed to my own, they are set in stone. To me, these discussions can be illuminating and often allow me to reevaluate what I believe as I learn things I didn't know and am exposed to ideas and opinions I hadn't considered. You seem unable even to consider the opinions of others or even to entertain the idea that they may have some validity.
I'll bow out and leave you to your lonely opinions and leave the debate to people like legalbeagle who, despite your efforts to muzzle debate, continues to represent the opinions of many rational, intelligent people around the world.
Message edited by author 2005-07-10 10:12:43.
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07/10/2005 10:17:51 AM · #166 |
If the detainees are considered prisoners of war than they get to stay locked up until the end of the war. No trials, no nothing. That is the way it is done. Period. Who in there right mind would let prisoners of war go prior to the end of the war???? Trial??? How???? Why???? Where in the history of mankind have any country released there prisoners prior to the end of the war? Once the war is over and if we keep them then a trial would be required. Not until then.
As to reference that Bush lied for the excuse to invade Iraq:
People forget, back then virtually every country was whinning and saying that Iraq had WMD's. Saddam would refused to allow UN to inspect questionable facilities until after he would have a opportunity to clean it up. (Hundreds of satilite photo's showed him moving something out of locations prior to the UN inspection. The UN would put deadlines after deadlines after deadlines. NOthing happened.
Saddam had one of the worlds largest military force. HIs reputation sucked. Iran/Iraq war, Kuwait, killing his own people, threating his other neighbors. He was a person who could not be trusted. The UN was unable to inspect his facilities. Reports from all different sources, Germany, England, Russia, US and others all claimed he was creating WMD's or tring to create such weapons.
There were terriorist in Afganistan, 9-11 happened. After invading Afganistan where do you think the terrorist would run to? Saddam was very friendly with them. He would protect them. With knowing his attitude, what he did to his people, lack of cooperation with the UN, the deadlines set by the UN, the threats from him. There was no choice.
The Bush administration made the call, the right call.
For the people who feel that we should not be there, or even went there. Look at what the alternative would have been for the prople of Iraq.
Freedom has no price. You have that, they did not. Your free to write in this thread, they did not. You can stand on the corner and question your government, they could not. You can travel where ever you want, they could not. There is so much we take for granted with our freedom.
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07/10/2005 10:19:46 AM · #167 |
Well...people continue to respond to me, although I stated I was done.
Please stop, I am not discussing the issue anymore. DPC is a great place to come and I see no need to let my personal views of the rest of the world come between me and a nice place to hang out.
The truth of the matter is, all views I shared here were very, very toned down. I could not even begin to discuss the way I feel about the subject at hand in anything less than a 10-page paper. Not to mention the fact that I'm just down-right angry so I can't think clearly.
Anyway...whatever. I realize I disagree with a lot of you, maybe most of the people here -- I don't care...that's what make me an individual. It will not affect the way I look at your photography, and certainly won't affect the way I shoot. What I'm saying is I'm just leaving this one in the Rant thread, it will not carry over...any anger I feel toward anyone right now, in this thread, will be kept in this thread. Just because we do not agree on one thing, doesn't mean we don't share a common bond through the love and joy of photography.
But whatever...like I said, I'm not discussing this thread anymore...just thought I'd throw that in there.
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07/10/2005 10:23:18 AM · #168 |
Originally posted by deapee:
It's not unamerican. You are from ENGLAND...what do you know about being an American? How can you tell me what American is and what American isn't? You don't know what I stand for. You don't know what my beliefs are. How are you to tell me I am not being American? |
You don't have to be American to be familiar with American ideals. Freedom of expression is one of the fundamentals. Now if you wish to insist that we have no "right" to express our opinions then that's fine - but it is undeniably unAmerican.
On the wider points, I suggest you go and learn a bit of your own history (what little of it you have) - isolationism has been tried before, and proved a bad idea. |
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07/10/2005 10:25:08 AM · #169 |
Originally posted by deapee:
Well...people continue to respond to me, although I stated I was done. |
I was writing my last response to you before you had posted your decision not to continue with this thread. I didn't see that post of yours until I had posted my latest.
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07/10/2005 10:33:19 AM · #170 |
| HOw one thread can turn into such a sh*t fight! hehehe....maybe we should all go back to our photos now? |
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07/10/2005 11:07:46 AM · #171 |
Originally posted by bcoble:
If the detainees are considered prisoners of war than they get to stay locked up until the end of the war. No trials, no nothing. That is the way it is done. Period. |
You're absolutely right - IF they were considered prisoners of war under the terms of the Geneva Conventions. However, the US administration has chosen NOT to consider them PoWs, primarily because then it gives them more flexibility in the treatment of the detainees.
Plus, of course, you'd have to define which "war" they were prisoners of - the "war on teror" being no more of an actual war than the "war on drugs".
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07/10/2005 11:15:29 AM · #172 |
Originally posted by ganders:
(snip)...the "war on teror" being no more of an actual war than the "war on drugs". |
I whole-heartedly believe both of those are VERY real...especially to the families who have lost loved ones on either side of the battle lines in each.
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07/10/2005 11:26:16 AM · #173 |
They are real issues, but they are not "war" in any normal sense of the word.
Edit: For example, a drug dealer captured by the "war on drugs" cannot possibly be considered a "prisoner of war" - he (along with any terrorist) is "just" a criminal.
Message edited by author 2005-07-10 11:29:00. |
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07/10/2005 11:26:25 AM · #174 |
Originally posted by laurielblack:
Originally posted by ganders:
(snip)...the "war on teror" being no more of an actual war than the "war on drugs". |
I whole-heartedly believe both of those are VERY real...especially to the families who have lost loved ones on either side of the battle lines in each. |
Of course they are REAL. They are real problems that really need to be fought.
But they aren't necessarily "wars" according to the commonly used definition of that term.
We can redefine the term if we want to but... that's a different issue.
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07/10/2005 11:36:40 AM · #175 |
Well, if you want to compare the war on terror with the war on drugs, consider that heroin production in Afghanistan has increased greatly (and this is understating the problem) since the Northern Alliance has taken over from the Taliban, thanks to the Bush administration, and that drug trafficing of these drugs are flooding countries in the middle east, Europe and Russia. The NA is also terrorists of their own people in their own right.
Seems to me that there are two fronts that we are losing on.
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