upgrading computer - DPChallenge Forums

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

06/22/2006 03:46:38 PM · #1

I think I need to upgrade my computer. Ever since I started using RAW, everything is slowed down way too much.

I was told that I need a combination of fast processor, fast HD, and lots of RAM.

Does anyone know where I can find info on all of this, sort of like the "dpreview" of computers or something like that?

DjFenzl

06/22/2006 03:49:40 PM · #2

cNet
or
Tom's Hardware

When you know what you want check out fatwallet.com for rebates, I recently got $750 off a $2,000 laptop.

Edit, I don't know why I didn't make real links the first time

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 15:51:01.

Count

Canon EOS-30D

06/22/2006 03:54:47 PM · #3

Hi Ursula, are you planning on going with a PC or a MAC?

Building your own, buying from a major vendor (Dell, Gateway, etc), or buying retail (Best Buy, Circuit City, etc)?

What are the specs on your current computer?

06/22/2006 04:12:16 PM · #4

Right now I have a Toshiba Satellite laptop, Intel Centrino 1.40 GHz processor, 512 MB of RAM, 50 GB harddrive. It's a wide screen. I have a second monitor attached (a ViewSonic).

I've always wanted to go MAC (I was stuck with PC because of work, but I'm in the process of slowly ending my current employment - hopefully by December, and then I have no idea what I'll do, YEAH!). But I am much more familiar with PC, and have had no problems with PC.

I hadn't decided on how to get a new computer - I imagine buying either from a major vendor or retail, I don't think I have the ability to build my own.

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

06/22/2006 04:12:54 PM · #5

Originally posted by Megatherian:

cNet
or
Tom's Hardware

When you know what you want check out fatwallet.com for rebates, I recently got $750 off a $2,000 laptop.

Edit, I don't know why I didn't make real links the first time

Thank you! I will check these in just a little while.

Count

Canon EOS-30D

06/22/2006 04:36:25 PM · #6

Last question, laptop or desktop?

Based on what you said I imagine an Intel MAC or a PC would be your best bet. With the new MAC you get the best of both worlds as far as software is concerned, though you still pay a premium for hardware.

With photo editing your biggest bottleneck is going to be RAM, if you're on a budget it would be best to sacrafice a step or two in CPU speed for more memory, I'd recommend 1GB-2GB of RAM (put as much in as your hardware will support).

AMD vs Intel both have their pro's and cons and I think the new CPU's from either will more than meet your needs, so you might not limit your search to one or the other.

Look for new SATA hard drives with Perpendicular Recording to join the Seagate Barracuda 750GB on the market soon. Get a platform that will support one of these drives as their speed and capacity is top notch for very little price difference.

Just some ideas to get you thinking of the possibilities...

Dave

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 16:37:09.

DjFenzl

06/22/2006 04:42:50 PM · #7

I have 1gb of ram.

I dual boot linux/windows.

In windows my swap file usage is minimum 50% pretty much all the time. I've used up to 1.5gb of page file using bibble pro.

In Linux my swap file is always at 0%. There is only 1 time that it used any at all and that was about 200mb using bibble pro to generate 8,000 thumbnails

Linux can run on mac or pc hardware so it doesn't really matter which "platform" you decide to buy.

99% of the software is free and installs within minutes - no rebooting required :)

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

06/22/2006 05:01:41 PM · #8

Monarch Computers has a good build your own system interface (you pick the parts and they build and test/burnin the system).

Building your own? //www.newegg.com has been good to me for many years.

If you trust Dell's on-line business practices and PCs in general there are coupon codes out that make the deals appealing. (from a professional pov I would steer you away from Dell but budget wise there are deals to be had).

I would steer you in the Direction of AMD as you get more bang for buck.

As Count stated I would tell you to get 2G ram, 1.5G very least.

There are plenty of Mid Range (last years high-end) vid cards that are very cheap now.

Sata Drives kick a$$ for access speeds but are still spendy for the amount of storage that you get.

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 17:02:34.

talmy

Nikon D300s

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 16-85 f/3.5-5.6G ED VR

06/22/2006 05:19:51 PM · #9

Ursula --

A new 20" iMac (with the Intel Core Duo processor) combined with a copy of Windows using either BootCamp or Parallels would give you the best of both worlds -- a Mac and a fast PC. You could migrate to Mac software as the "universal binary" versions become available, meanwhile run any existing Windows apps in a Parallels window (or boot Windows under BootCamp). Existing Mac PowerPC apps run under Rosetta, which is reasonably fast but not the best way to go for Photoshop.

(This is my plan for later this year -- I'm currently PC based, but have a G4 iBook -- too slow -- and prefer the Mac OS X interface.)

No matter what you do, if you use Nikon Capture it is happiest with 2GB of RAM. I found that 1 GB wasn't enough. Maybe Capture NX will be better, though.

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 17:21:45.

GuGi

Nikon D750

Nikon AF Zoom-Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8 VR DG IF-ED

06/22/2006 05:39:37 PM · #10

Originally posted by ursula:

I am seriously thinking of going Mac. A 12" powerbook with lots of ram to start with while I am getting used to it. I travel a lot and it's a fantastic size to bring along and be able to empty the card and take a good look at what I have accomplished so far. Then a good screen when I have saved some money again.
But before I do this, I would love a 70-200VR, might even buy it bundled with a D200. What a daydreamer I am :) This is my plan more or less, might take time.
I have 512 ram and like you, since I went RAW, it's slow, so very slow.

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

06/22/2006 05:45:28 PM · #11

Originally posted by Count:

With the new MAC you get the best of both worlds as far as software is concerned, though you still pay a premium for hardware.

True, and not true, respectively. From a New York Times review:

the MacBook is actually less expensive than its closest major Windows competitor. That would be the Sony Vaio VGN-SZ240, which also has a 13.3-inch screen with the same resolution, includes a built-in camera, and is available with the same processor and the same memory and hard-disk capacity as the MacBook,"... "When configured to match the major specs of the base model of the MacBook, the Sony costs $1,629, over 60% more than the MacBook's $1,099 base price.

Regarding performance:

Originally posted by scalvert:

...a 13" MacBook is faster than a Dell dual 3.6Ghz Xeon workstation and holds its own against (in some respects beats) a quad-processor 2.21GHz Alienware Opteron system. The MacBook's [temporary] weakness is that the Mac version of Photoshop is slow because Adobe hasn't finished the universal binary code yet, however the Windows version runs extremely fast on a MacBook.

FWIW, Amazon sells Macs with a $100-200 mail-in rebate. If you're a college student, you can buy directly from Apple's online education store and get a $100 discount PLUS a free iPod Nano.

scarbrd

Leica M10

Leica 35mm f/1.4 Summilux M Aspherical MF - Black

06/22/2006 06:01:27 PM · #12

Ditto on all the Mac suggestions. I use both Mac and Windows. (Mac at home, Windows at work)

If you go with one of the new Intel based Macs, keep in mind that Photoshop CS2 is not Universal yet. It must run under Rosetta to work and you will get a performace hit.

You might still be able to find some deals on PowerPC based Macs. Photoshop will run native on those.

Adobe is on record saying there will not be an Intel native version of PS until CS3, probably next year.

If you get a Windows box, be sure to get one spec'd out to handle Vista. Not minimum specs, but recommended specs.

If it were me, I'd go with a Mac for sure.

Good luck!

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 18:12:01.

Telehubbie

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

06/22/2006 06:05:33 PM · #13

Dell has some deals right now on desktops. I quickly configured one:

Dimension E510
3Ghz, 2 gigs RAM, 250 gig hard drive, yada yada yada, WITH a 20 widescreen for $1189 (regular $1539). I know that you already have a monitor, but they don't have an option to NOT include a monitor and take the price off the total, so I added the 20 in widescreen since I love mine.

It tried a link to the configuration, but it only takes you to the base model, but thought you could play around with it if you wanted:
Dell

talmy

Nikon D300s

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 16-85 f/3.5-5.6G ED VR

06/22/2006 10:15:36 PM · #14

Originally posted by scalvert:

...a 13" MacBook is faster than a Dell dual 3.6Ghz Xeon workstation

Originally posted by scalvert:

FWIW, Amazon sells Macs with a $100-200 mail-in rebate. If you're a college student, you can buy directly from Apple's online education store and get a $100 discount PLUS a free iPod Nano.

I get the discount as a part time instructor. It's even better because they have heavy discounts on the extended warranty (Applecare) and all software products. I ended up saving about 25% on my iBook last summer. Much better than Amazon's deal, and the system is Build To Order while on Amazon there are very limited choices.

crayon

Panasonic Lumix DMC-FH1

06/22/2006 10:27:59 PM · #15

Originally posted by ursula:

I think I need to upgrade my computer. Ever since I started using RAW, everything is slowed down way too much.
I was told that I need a combination of fast processor, fast HD, and lots of RAM.

Just some tips to clear misconceptions on building a fast computer:
1. lots of RAM do not speed things - choose a speedy RAM. Look for those with the fastest rating. example DDR2-800MHz modules
2. you need a speedy HDD - get a SCSI or at least a SATA type harddisk. They are very fast.
The 2 items above really speeds things up significantly.

fotomann_forever

06/22/2006 10:28:41 PM · #16

Fast and quiet

talmy

Nikon D300s

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 16-85 f/3.5-5.6G ED VR

06/22/2006 10:33:50 PM · #17

After talking about Macs, let me add few words about Dells (I've bought quite a few of them in recent years). I've found that the same systems were always less expensive, and with more selection options, when purchased from the Small Business site. Recently they have obscured the mater by offering different models on the Home site than on the Small Business site, but the systems and configurations on the Small Business site are much more oriented toward professional use -- the Home systems make the assumption that if you need a powerful system it must be for gaming. The support is much better on the Small Business side as well.

For graphics use I'd suggest the Precision Workstation 380.

coronamv

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Sigma 24-70mm F2.8 IF EX DG HSM for Canon

06/22/2006 10:45:22 PM · #18

One down side to the new intel macs. they run all current software slow. They will improve once universal comes out "what ever that is" Laptops have a couple of drawbacks to. One is the video card. Unles you are planning to spend a ton of money on a high end laptop you will most likely get a intel graphics adapter. Not good for much more than wordprocessing and web surfing. Even the new intel based macs are using them. Along with that the hard drives in most laptops unless you upgrade use 4500 rpm drives(you have to really look for this info when buying) the guys at most retailers will not have this info. So unless you plan to dump a ton of money into a laptop like say $4000 or more go with a desktop. AMD Intel both good SCSI hdd's more expensive but better that SATA as much ram as you can afford.Oh yeah a graphics card designed for editing and not games. You can have a nice pc build for around $2000 with the same software available as on macs. Monitors is another area remember if you go lcd there is a difference in grade. What dell IBM HP or gateway gives you are not the same quality as Lacie Viewsonic or NEC. Good luck.

coronamv

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Sigma 24-70mm F2.8 IF EX DG HSM for Canon

06/22/2006 10:51:14 PM · #19

Originally posted by talmy:

[quote=scalvert]...a 13" MacBook is faster than a Dell dual 3.6Ghz Xeon workstation

A fairly common comparison (the Dell dual Xeon workstation), but I'll tell you this, as a user (at work) of a Dell dual 3.2GHz GHz system with a catalog price of $8000 -- it runs slower than my $1000 Dell 3.2GHz Pentium 4 at home! So it's an easy mark.

Xeon is a serve based processors designed for heavy traffic and use. These processors are not designed for graphics as in photoshop etc. They lack the instructions found in Most P4 or 64 bit amd chips. The main thing that makes them fast is the amount of cache onboard the processor. Which if you were running a server for such a task as a Database they run circles around anything else. Besides alpha based risc processors on board a AS400 or greater. COmpare apples to apples not oranges. thanks

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

06/22/2006 11:10:23 PM · #20

Originally posted by coronamv:

Originally posted by scalvert:
...a 13" MacBook is faster than a Dell dual 3.6Ghz Xeon workstation

Xeon is a serve based processors designed for heavy traffic and use. These processors are not designed for graphics as in photoshop etc.

Ya' might want to take a gander at some Photoshop benchmarks before you say that. Note also that Apple's low-end MacBooks nearly matched QUAD-processor Opteron desktop systems (with dedicated graphics cards)!

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

06/22/2006 11:25:23 PM · #21

Originally posted by coronamv:

One down side to the new intel macs. They run all current software slow. Unless you are planning to spend a ton of money on a high end laptop you will most likely get a intel graphics adapter. Not good for much more than wordprocessing and web surfing... Along with that the hard drives in most laptops unless you upgrade use 4500 rpm drives... Monitors is another area remember if you go lcd there is a difference in grade. What dell IBM HP or gateway gives you are not the same quality as Lacie Viewsonic or NEC. Good luck.

Oh, let's see here... you're 0 for 4 on these points. Most of the software you'd commonly use on a Mac is already universal binary (iPhoto, Safari, etc.) and wicked-fast. Ursula most likely has a Windows version of Photoshop, which will run like a cheetah with a thorn under its tail if you run it in Windows on an Intel Mac.

Note in the tests that the low-end MacBooks with Intel graphics actually ran Photoshop faster than MacBook Pro models with dedicated ATI 128MB graphics cards. Unless you're playing games or modeling 3D, the integrated video is a non-issue.

Apple doesn't sell a laptop with a 4500rpm hard drive. The lowest-end base model HD runs at 5400rpm, and their highest-end 17" laptop retails for $2799- a far cry from your $4000 figure.

The higher-end Dell LCD monitors are inexpensive and among the best monitors out there. We have several designers using them at my office, and the image quality is really impressive when calibrated.

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 23:26:35.

Telehubbie

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

06/22/2006 11:37:19 PM · #22

How about an Alienware that's liquid cooled and has 4 graphics cards?

Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS

06/22/2006 11:51:25 PM · #23

Thanks for all the answers/suggestions and so on. Much appreciated.
I guess these things are never easy. I wish they were.

awpollard

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

06/22/2006 11:53:04 PM · #24

how bout a Tablet PC where it's a laptop or the screen swivels around, lays flat and becomes a tablet with touch screen...

I know shameless plug for a sister company... but I got to play with one of these and they are sweet.

ED: Check the gallery shots

Message edited by author 2006-06-22 23:55:17.