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12/27/2003 12:21:50 AM · #176 |
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
I have never really liked that in case of a DQ the exif file would have to go to all of site council and now that it is a case of top 10 finishing photos have to submit exif file to all of the site council I am sitting back and thinking hard if I want to be subjected to this rule or just walk away. |
What's wrong with it? Are you saying you would be offended if asked to submit the original? I wouldn't be.
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
Maybe what would make several people, myself included feel better about having to submit exif files to site council is a current and uptodate list of who all are members of site council. So we know exactly who all is getting the files. |
Why would that help? I really doubt anyone is going to steal your pictures. If you think that might happen, just put a watermark in it.
General... I'm talking about those who CHEAT and don't do well will probably stop participating, not those who do not cheat. We know you don't cheat, that's why you have been around for ever. :)
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12/27/2003 12:22:22 AM · #177 |
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
I am sitting back and thinking hard if I want to be subjected to this rule or just walk away.
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prolly easier just to walk away. that's what I'd do if i were you.
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12/27/2003 12:23:46 AM · #178 |
Originally posted by ChrisW123:
Originally posted by Gringo:
I don't like the idea of trying to compete in a photo contest with photographers who have thousands of archive photographs to choose from. If they are questioned about the date of the photograph, they simply get DQ'd. If they are not questioned, they win and steel the ribbon from the rightful winners. |
Right, that's why this rule is good. It'll discourage cheaters. I personally don't think there are that many cheaters who participate, because I don't see the reason or motivation behind it. If you cheat by submitting a photo from a year ago, for example, what is the point? You know you cheated, you don't win any money, you are just a cheater and you know it. Don't know what anyone would gain from that.
Originally posted by Gringo:
I think every entry should be sent with the original and the site counsel should have access to them all if they have any questions at all. Then they need only view the ones necessary to keep the rules enforced. |
Bad idea.... there's no reason to request the original for every photo. Can you imagine how much disk space and extra work that would require? It's much better to request the orig from the top 10 (or so) winners only. Who cares if photo 152 out of 223 cheated or not? Those are the ones who won't be around long anyway because they will lose intrest quickly. |
Well, I agree it would be cumbersome to require originals from everyone, but at least nobody would be singled out. It wouldn't take up much space if they were deleted after each contest as one would hope they are.
And I think everyone below the cheater would care that # 152 cheated.
I'm all for regulating and enforcing the rules. |
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12/27/2003 12:40:01 AM · #179 |
Originally posted by ChrisW123:
Why would that help? I really doubt anyone is going to steal your pictures. If you think that might happen, just put a watermark in it.
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Thats the problem you can't watermark the orginal or it changes the exif info.
As for stealing my photos, want to talk about several thousand photos I had taken from me to be used for another project and that person is making money from them but I'm not. I won't see a dime from those images cause they didn't have a copyright or watermark on the files he used. They were copyrighted but the files he used weren't marked. |
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12/27/2003 12:49:38 AM · #180 |
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
Originally posted by ChrisW123:
Why would that help? I really doubt anyone is going to steal your pictures. If you think that might happen, just put a watermark in it.
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Thats the problem you can't watermark the orginal or it changes the exif info.
As for stealing my photos, want to talk about several thousand photos I had taken from me to be used for another project and that person is making money from them but I'm not. I won't see a dime from those images cause they didn't have a copyright or watermark on the files he used. They were copyrighted but the files he used weren't marked. |
Sue him.
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12/27/2003 01:03:41 AM · #181 |
Originally posted by ChrisW123:
General... I'm talking about those who CHEAT and don't do well will probably stop participating, not those who do not cheat. |
Yeah, good point.
Watermarking won't work in this case as the file would definitely be considered edited and not the original. |
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12/27/2003 01:07:42 AM · #182 |
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
Originally posted by ChrisW123:
Why would that help? I really doubt anyone is going to steal your pictures. If you think that might happen, just put a watermark in it.
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Thats the problem you can't watermark the orginal or it changes the exif info.
As for stealing my photos, want to talk about several thousand photos I had taken from me to be used for another project and that person is making money from them but I'm not. I won't see a dime from those images cause they didn't have a copyright or watermark on the files he used. They were copyrighted but the files he used weren't marked. |
Sue him. |
Ditto. Register the works and sue. There is no longer a requirement that every image carry the © mark in order for the copyright to be enforced. If you can prove you took them you will retain the copyright. If you can demonstrate that the other party should reasonably have known the images were copyrighted, and the infringement therefore willful, you can probably get punitive as well as actual damages and attorney's fees. |
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12/27/2003 06:49:05 AM · #183 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
Originally posted by ChrisW123:
Why would that help? I really doubt anyone is going to steal your pictures. If you think that might happen, just put a watermark in it.
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Thats the problem you can't watermark the orginal or it changes the exif info.
As for stealing my photos, want to talk about several thousand photos I had taken from me to be used for another project and that person is making money from them but I'm not. I won't see a dime from those images cause they didn't have a copyright or watermark on the files he used. They were copyrighted but the files he used weren't marked. |
Sue him. |
Ditto. Register the works and sue. There is no longer a requirement that every image carry the © mark in order for the copyright to be enforced. If you can prove you took them you will retain the copyright. If you can demonstrate that the other party should reasonably have known the images were copyrighted, and the infringement therefore willful, you can probably get punitive as well as actual damages and attorney's fees. |
Wish I could sue him but I can't, already spoke with a few different attornies who have told me since he changed the medium of the images I can't sue for copyright infrigements. I might be awarded a small settlement cause I can prove he used my likeness but even that would be difficult to win cause what he did with the images has been being done for years. |
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12/27/2003 07:29:02 AM · #184 |
No kidding. I can't see myself having so much grief over this. Life is too short for all theses stresses. Walk away.
Originally posted by Pedro:
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
I am sitting back and thinking hard if I want to be subjected to this rule or just walk away.
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prolly easier just to walk away. that's what I'd do if i were you. |
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12/27/2003 09:25:59 AM · #185 |
| Why are you so stressed over showing an original? Just walk away then because you are acting way out of line for what is going on here. |
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12/27/2003 10:46:16 AM · #186 |
"I have read, understood, and followed all of the site rules."
either you comply and submit your photo, or you don't and you sit the challenge out. it really is just as simple as that.
deal with it. |
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12/27/2003 11:07:21 AM · #187 |
if you are an american - just think about your social security number, and how many people use that -w/o your permission, and how much more harmful it could be than someone looking closely at one of your photos.
that puts this silly digital image bickering in perspective. |
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12/27/2003 11:21:04 AM · #188 |
Originally posted by soup:
if you are an american - just think about your social security number, and how many people use that -w/o your permission, and how much more harmful it could be than someone looking closely at one of your photos.
that puts this silly digital image bickering in perspective. |
DING DING DING!! Hadn't thought of that one. Certainly true!! |
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12/27/2003 11:26:06 AM · #189 |
| This seems to me so much of a tempest in a teapot. And, yes, I've had my property both actual and intellectual stolen at times (not photography related)and it is frustrating, but life goes on. If you've got a modicum of talent, the few photographs you're submitting to challenges on this site are not going to hurt you even if someone were to steal your image. If you don't like the heat, stay out of the kitchen. I had a photograph that I wanted to submit last week for the boundaries challenge, but when I started to post it, I realized it was one day out of the submission dates. It was too late by the time I realized it so I threw up a bad one (with a good concept) at the last minute. The idea, while tempting, of going ahead and posting the image and taking my chances crossed my mind briefly - but was immediately discarded as I just couldn't knowingly violate the rules. I'd have no trouble at all with providing my exif data were it requested. |
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12/27/2003 03:32:41 PM · #190 |
I have been following this thread since it started, and I must say it is very interesting. While I understand both sides of the issue, I myself would have no problem submitting the original for validation. I have submitted a photo for the Holiday Decorations challenge and after adjusting the contrast a bit, I accidentally saved over my original. I know that if my photo ends up in the top xx at the end of the challenge, I will be DQ'ed because I cannot send in the original... but thats ok. I didn't pay to enter the contest, nor do I stand to lose anything if I do get DQ'ed. Even though I didn't cheat, and it was an honest mistake it's still my mistake and therefore I would have to live with the DQ. Heck, if I didn't like the rules I just wouldn't enter the challenges. Period.
Now don't get me wrong, I don't condone not saving the originals but in this case it was an honest mistake. I took the picture, transferred it to my computer, and I didn't look at it again for several hours and in the mean time I erased my memory card on my camera so I could take more photos.
The one consolation? Even if I do get a DQ, I still get to see where my photo would have placed.
Dan
Message edited by author 2003-12-27 15:33:09. |
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12/27/2003 04:20:50 PM · #191 |
After reading this thread and seeing some of the concerns that people have, my opinion is this. Before you do anything with your photos back them up. Burning to a CD is the best way you can do this. Also it seems to me that some people are forgetting that this is a Digital Photograghy Contest. NOT a photoshop contest.
This is my humble opinion.(like it or not) |
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12/30/2003 07:36:50 AM · #192 |
Originally posted by daninbc:
I have been following this thread since it started, and I must say it is very interesting. While I understand both sides of the issue, I myself would have no problem submitting the original for validation. I have submitted a photo for the Holiday Decorations challenge and after adjusting the contrast a bit, I accidentally saved over my original. I know that if my photo ends up in the top xx at the end of the challenge, I will be DQ'ed because I cannot send in the original... but thats ok. I didn't pay to enter the contest, nor do I stand to lose anything if I do get DQ'ed. Even though I didn't cheat, and it was an honest mistake it's still my mistake and therefore I would have to live with the DQ. Heck, if I didn't like the rules I just wouldn't enter the challenges. Period.
Now don't get me wrong, I don't condone not saving the originals but in this case it was an honest mistake. I took the picture, transferred it to my computer, and I didn't look at it again for several hours and in the mean time I erased my memory card on my camera so I could take more photos.
The one consolation? Even if I do get a DQ, I still get to see where my photo would have placed.
Dan |
Likewise, I took 200+ images over xmas and one is nice so I am submitting it to the decmeber free for all challenge. Being that I saved these in .jpegs rather than NEF files as I didn't foresee any being good enough for a challenge entry (just hloiday snapshots) I worked on the originals.
Now I am in the position where I have a nice shot that I want to submit, but know that if I get a DQ request I can submit the unedited version (I can submit the original, but it has obviously changed)
However, I can't see any reason for a DQ apart from someone thinking it wasn't taken in december, so i have submitted anyway, I think being that I worked on the original the exif will be the same?
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12/30/2003 07:40:59 AM · #193 |
Originally posted by jonpink:
However, I can't see any reason for a DQ apart from someone thinking it wasn't taken in december, so i have submitted anyway, I think being that I worked on the original the exif will be the same? |
It will be mostly the same, but not identical. My perspective of the original request is that the EXIF is 'original' and unedited, not so much intact.
Amendments that PS7 makes are (at the least):
Software: Adobe Photoshop 7.0
Date Time:
The 'Date Time Original' and 'Date Time Digitized' fields should remain the same. However, technically this isn't 'original' EXIF data.
I think I'd do the same as you in this instance, submit and see how you go. :-)
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12/30/2003 12:29:15 PM · #194 |
As far as time & date issues a simple timing additon to the dp site would take care of that problem. When time & dates run out for submission on a challenge the program would simply deny you submissions.
Frankie |
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12/30/2003 12:33:12 PM · #195 |
As far as stealing images...If your that concearned you should be making dups one with copy right protection and one for dp submission.
Frankie |
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01/07/2004 11:55:54 AM · #196 |
| So do you want that in raw or tiff? When I convert it to tiff I'm losing the Exif from the Canon software don't know why but I was hoping they would fix it. I guess if you have photogshop CS you should be able to read my raw file or Canon software. Tell me where to submit it? |
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01/07/2004 12:51:17 PM · #197 |
I can't really figure out what kind of proof the original would give to the site council, as I'm pretty sure that the EXIF data of a picture can be modified as we want...
Message edited by author 2004-01-07 13:23:01. |
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01/07/2004 03:23:13 PM · #198 |
Originally posted by eweb:
I can't really figure out what kind of proof the original would give to the site council, as I'm pretty sure that the EXIF data of a picture can be modified as we want... |
Date might not be the only thing we are checking. And there are techniques for detecting if the original EXIF has been edited.
If you know a better way for us to verify that a photo complies with the rules, we'd be glad to hear it. |
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01/07/2004 03:55:44 PM · #199 |
no, I don't know any other solution. So I'm glad to hear that there are some solutions to find if an EXIF has been altered. And I totally approve that you ask the original for the top pics in a challenge
Thanks for your answer |
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01/07/2004 05:30:45 PM · #200 |
| I have the perfect solution just give us a theme each week and let us do the rest. The rule of size and resolution is enough handicap then you wouldn't have to worry if someone cheated or not. So how long has this rule of the top five been in place? I think you ought to go back to the day of conception of the website for there has to be people that have placed that shouldn't be there for its just human nature to cheat especially in today's society. |
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