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01/19/2004 08:43:44 AM · #1 |
Hi, I am just starting into digital photography and as any other amateur photographer I am training with family, architecture and nature. Nevertheless sometimes there are scenes I see on the street that would look good in pictures the problem being that there are people I do not know in them. How do you generally break your own psychological barrier and take those shots? How do you approach the people without making them so aware of the shot that it breaks the natural tone of it?
Many thanks,
Luis Morais |
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01/19/2004 08:51:14 AM · #2 |
sometimes I will act if the people i am shooting are in my way if they see me, I just play it off like I am waiting on them to move "out of my way" and usually that calms them down and they usually will ignore you.
But each situation is different
James |
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01/19/2004 08:52:59 AM · #3 |
Here's what I tried to bear in mind, if you're thinking of the sneaky approach. :-) I think humans only have peripheral vision up to 45 degrees either side from the direction they're looking in.. So - I tried to stand outside of that angle.
I think JonPink mentioned a while ago he'd had some bad experiences taking shots of strangers?
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01/19/2004 08:56:28 AM · #4 |
Originally posted by PaulMdx:
I think JonPink mentioned a while ago he'd had some bad experiences taking shots of strangers? |
That's coz he broke into their houses for some 'lifestyle' shots. ;D
Message edited by author 2004-01-19 08:56:47. |
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01/19/2004 08:57:28 AM · #5 |
Originally posted by Imagineer:
That's coz he broke into their houses for some 'lifestyle' shots. ;D |
LOL, now you're giving us all ideas.. ;-)
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01/19/2004 10:12:58 AM · #6 |
Is my name being dragged through the mud here...lol
Yes I had bad occasions twice. Once shooting some canoe dudes, got asked (told) to leave and made to feel like a weirdo for taking photographs of a sport. Duh
Second time I went to shoot some swimmers for a challenge, and was basicly told that I wasn't allowed. Fair enough, so I now pre check if going to an occasion of some kind.
Apart from that I just hide behind corners with my big lens ;) |
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01/19/2004 10:59:05 AM · #7 |
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01/19/2004 01:20:24 PM · #8 |
for what it's worth, just got bugged again by someone complaining about photos! Only this time, for taking photographs of a stupid street sign! I was very sarcastic so he left, unamused ;) Tw*t.
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01/19/2004 01:24:58 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by jonpink:
for what it's worth, just got bugged again by someone complaining about photos! Only this time, for taking photographs of a stupid street sign! I was very sarcastic so he left, unamused ;) Tw*t. |
I would tell him he should be more concerned about that government camera up on the pole taking his picture.
Message edited by author 2004-01-19 13:25:52. |
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01/19/2004 01:54:43 PM · #10 |
Left you a comment on this photo.
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by jonpink:
for what it's worth, just got bugged again by someone complaining about photos! Only this time, for taking photographs of a stupid street sign! I was very sarcastic so he left, unamused ;) Tw*t. |
I would tell him he should be more concerned about that government camera up on the pole taking his picture.
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01/19/2004 02:01:27 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by Olyuzi:
Left you a comment on this photo. |
Thanks! The goal was not so much to create a futuristic look as to intoduce enough contrast into a very poor exposure that enough detail can be seen and the subject identified. The weird color shifts are just a (un)fortunate byproduct. |
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01/20/2004 09:28:39 AM · #12 |
He he he he that is great!!!
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01/20/2004 09:41:14 AM · #13 |
Interesting, mate. The funny thing I have noticed is that comparatively South Americans have a wider peripheral vision than British/German people. Whilst a British guy will not notice nothing happening by his side (such as you giving that occasional check on his girlfriend's derriere) a Brazilian guy intercepts you before your thought reaches the central nervous system :).
But seriously, you know when I was living in Spain I have met a couple of photographers who would simply take pictures of people freely. It seems that by the law, whatever is on the street is considered public even the people walking on it. I live in the UK and would really like to know if there are any laws like the Spanish one in effect here.
Originally posted by PaulMdx:
Here's what I tried to bear in mind, if you're thinking of the sneaky approach. :-) I think humans only have peripheral vision up to 45 degrees either side from the direction they're looking in.. So - I tried to stand outside of that angle.
I think JonPink mentioned a while ago he'd had some bad experiences taking shots of strangers? |
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01/20/2004 10:31:10 AM · #14 |
Originally posted by luismorais:
But seriously, you know when I was living in Spain I have met a couple of photographers who would simply take pictures of people freely. It seems that by the law, whatever is on the street is considered public even the people walking on it. I live in the UK and would really like to know if there are any laws like the Spanish one in effect here. |
In Iceland there is no law that says it, just an unwritten one. I once asked about it and the answer I got was that I can take picture of anything in a public places but if I'm gona publish their name with the image (on internet or news letter) then I should ask that person before I publish. |
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01/20/2004 10:54:13 AM · #15 |
Hi JonPink,
I was checking your website. Really cool mate, I checked your photography work and it kind of gave me an insight about all this discussion. I have noticed you have used very few subjects including yourself in most of work and the pics (from an amateur point of view they look great!) |
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01/20/2004 11:07:05 AM · #16 |
The law might be on your side (e.g. free to take pictures in public places), but you have to assume that not everybody knows the law or agrees with it.
People might still get agressive. So if in doubt, better ask first.
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01/20/2004 12:17:37 PM · #17 |
Yeah, I see Willem. I for one avoid taking pictures of somebody else's kids even if they are playing with my little one. My neighbour is having a birthday party for their boy and I am really thinking if it would be kind to volunteer to take pictures but I am really considering it carefully if so, I will take the pictures, download them to their computer and format the microdrive there in front of them. Man I am really paranoid, you see that is the psychological block I meant in my original question. When did they turn a camera and good intentions into a crime? Better double the Prozac, I think...
As to shots of adults the block is a bit different, it has to do with the fact people can react really weird and I am too self-conscious to take pictures of people I do not know. Well anyway I will have to break this barrier later when I am more confident with the work I will be doing, I think the 2 things (experience and nosiness) really come together, don't you think? |
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01/20/2004 12:29:20 PM · #18 |
I was chased off more than one site for not having permission to be there. But that was a safety issue and we knew about it beforehand but it was too much waiting around for approval so we just went and were ready to run :-)
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01/20/2004 01:19:51 PM · #19 |
If you do decide to ask, you can always say you're a photography student, or an art student, and you're doing work for a project.
People are much more willing to accept that you have a project to complete, than that it's just a hobby. |
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01/20/2004 01:24:46 PM · #20 |
Because I want to publish, post, and/or sell some of my photos, I never take photos of people without their permission because they're unusable without a release form.
But that doesn't speak to the ethical issue all of this brings up for me. I feel that people have the right to their privacy. Admittedly, I don't have the guerilla mentality that many photographers do but it's because I've come to realize, as I've gotten older, how harmful it can be to society as a whole if people aren't given due respect in something that I see as my (egocentric) art making. I don't like the idea of tricking people into not realizing they're being photographed.
But, maybe it's only unpleasant reactions which will stop most photographers from taking pictures of people without getting permission. An artist I know who is in his 60's, black, and very
strong physically is always having to deal with this because young, white photographers often take his picture when he's out walking or
on a bus or BART (public train system). He always asks them politely to stop (they never ask him first) but, if they don't, he'll break their cameras. Once he threw one under a BART train. In his life to date, only a show of force has ever gotten him respectful treatment.
I have much better luck with people whom I treat with respect and the shots I miss because of people saying no are very few. What's interesting, too, is that I've crossed some difficult race, class, and cultural barriers that way which otherwise would have been closed to me. In germany, I got to travel with some Romany (gypsies) for a while because I approached them before I took any pictures - I never would have dreamed I'd get to do that, all I wanted was a few shots of them in a rest stop on the Autobahn.
Perhaps it's because I'm female and biracial that I am sensitive to these issues but photographers (who have historically been mostly male and white) have tended to see the world, especially the third world, people of different races, women, and people of different cultures and/or those in poverty as being fair game for their artistic 'statements'. Unless people are paid models, I think they should be asked for their collaboration instead, even if it's after the fact. (After all, some pictures are time sensitive, and once it's known you're taking the picture, a person's demeanor usually does change).
I admit that I sometimes feel shackled by my own ethical stance but I place more importance on some things than others and I realized long ago that it would limit some of the things I'd feel comfortable doing.
Maybe that's why I do most of my 'people' work using drawing and painting rather than photography. :)
I'd love to hear other people's comments on any of this, pro or con. (Really! I don't take it personally if someone doesn't agree with me. We all have a right to our opinions, too. :)
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01/20/2004 01:30:56 PM · #21 |
| On sunday Took a picture of a homeless person trying to push his shopping cart down an ally way that was covered with ice. He saw me and quickened his pace. I didn't think nothing of it and walked further downtown. I was then waiting at a light to cross and I heard this strange noise comming up behind me. I had my headphones on. Sure Enough I turned around and there he was about 10 paces behind me running with the shopping cart at full tilt strait for me. I was outa there I ended up loosing him in a park a few blocks away. |
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01/20/2004 01:46:17 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by Martyr:
On sunday Took a picture of a homeless person trying to push his shopping cart down an ally way that was covered with ice. He saw me and quickened his pace. I didn't think nothing of it and walked further downtown. I was then waiting at a light to cross and I heard this strange noise comming up behind me. I had my headphones on. Sure Enough I turned around and there he was about 10 paces behind me running with the shopping cart at full tilt strait for me. I was outa there I ended up loosing him in a park a few blocks away. |
YIKES! That is another good reason to ask first, the mentality of some of the people who live on the street can be questionable and dangerous!
Deannda
Glad you're okay
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01/20/2004 02:03:50 PM · #23 |
| easy, shoot from a moving car and have a good zoom. |
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01/20/2004 02:11:29 PM · #24 |
I have some homemade business cards that I carry with me. I just approach the person, hand them a card, tell them why I need there picture (make up a good story if the truth sounds lame), and tell them that you would gladly e-mail them copies of the final product if they e-mail you.
So far, I only had 2 people tell me they didn't want their picture taken and 1 person ever e-mailed me. I've asked about 20.
The biggest downside is that many people make great subjects but horrible models. Once they know they are in the picture their ability to act or pose natural is gone. |
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01/20/2004 02:15:49 PM · #25 |
Originally posted by carlacryptic:
...I feel that people have the right to their privacy. Admittedly, I don't have the guerilla mentality that many photographers do but it's because I've come to realize, as I've gotten older, how harmful it can be to society as a whole if people aren't given due respect in something that I see as my (egocentric) art making. I don't like the idea of tricking people into not realizing they're being photographed... |
This is a very sensitive and laudable stance you take, Carla. I cannot, however, embrace your views on what you call egocentric artmaking without exception. While I agree strongly with you on the manner of taking candids for no more than your own gain, the opposite may apply as well. I believe that some of the best and worthwhile shots of this type may not involve any ego at all, neither by intent nor effectually. Such photos, instead, award the world something without which it would be so much poorer. Even candids taken in a journalistic manner can contribute something quite worthwhile.
Photography (including certain candids), in this sense, can, IMO, provide considerable stimuli in support of sensitizing our world. When this is the case, the ethics you appear to confine to a human subject may also, and justifyably, be extended to the entire species. (Opinion)
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