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 07/05/2009 03:35:42 PM · #1
Ok so I have a pretty good opportunity going on right now. I will be meeting up with a band next week that will be signed to Universal soon. They want quality for their Album cover. I want to do things differently though with rights and all that. Here is what Im thinking.

Creative fee - $500.
As for granting rights, this is my plan. Instead of charging per amount that is published I want to charge per album sold.
I grant them exclusive rights to the design/picture. I dont give them a timeline, they have the picture as long as necessary.
I receive a dollar per album sold. They get rights to use the picture for the Album cover for physical CD's sold and for electronic
uses like iTunes and all that.

What are your thoughts as far as a game plan? Specific details would be pressed out later in proper contracts and whatnot.
 07/05/2009 04:46:05 PM · #2
I think $1 per use for something like the download sites is not likely as they sell in the 1-3 range and your not going to anything like 1/2. If they sign for the label then I doubt $1 is likely either as new artists are not likely to get that.

The other main issue I see is how do you agree on the sales? You are not going to get access to the info from the record company and possibly not fully from the band, so even if you trust them it's hard to verify.

I like the idea, just would need some logistics on how to measure & enforce and I think they margins will not be as large as you believe.
 07/05/2009 05:00:53 PM · #3
If you had written (or performed) one of the songs on the album, you'd get a royalty of about $0.08/copy ... but if you can get a "royalty"/sale at any rate it could be a good deal; Robert Ablanalp became a billionaire by collecting (as I've heard it) a $0.01 royalty for each of those little push-button valves on the tops of aerosol spray cans.

Note that the big record companies are notorious for devising ways to avoid paying royalties ... :-(
 07/05/2009 05:46:32 PM · #4
I will put the royalty part in the contract with the arranged details from
the record company. I am doing a book cover for someone and they agreed on the $1 royalty. I might just have to find a different rate.
 07/05/2009 06:27:38 PM · #5
Found a list of the cost breakdown of a CD you may find helpful:
//andrewapeterson.com/2007/11/arists-royalties-cd-sales-real-numbers/
This breakdown of the cost of a typical major-label release by the independent market-research firm Almighty Institute of Music Retail shows where the money goes for a new album with a list price of $15.99.

â€Â¢$0.17 Musicians’ unions
â€Â¢$0.80 Packaging/manufacturing
â€Â¢$0.82 Publishing royalties
â€Â¢$0.80 Retail profit
â€Â¢$0.90 Distribution
â€Â¢$1.60 Artists’ royalties
â€Â¢$1.70 Label profit
â€Â¢$2.40 Marketing/promotion
â€Â¢$2.91 Label overhead
â€Â¢$3.89 Retail overhead
 07/05/2009 06:51:33 PM · #6
so 1 dollar isnt me being out of my mind and asking too much then
 07/05/2009 07:00:47 PM · #7
Um, I believe that "Artists Royalties" is what goes to the band, not the cover art.

Originally posted by mgarsteck:
so 1 dollar isnt me being out of my mind and asking too much then

07/05/2009 07:41:25 PM · #8
ah ok. well I did see in the article that they use 5k for artwork for the album
 07/05/2009 07:50:39 PM · #9
Those figures are for a major band at a big label.
07/05/2009 08:35:53 PM · #10
Congrats on the opportunity.

I don't think you'll get the $1 per... but anything per will be good if they succeed.
07/05/2009 08:37:59 PM · #11
Yeah, im sure I will see how it all goes. I meet this week to discuss it more. I sent the assistant pastor my website through email when I heard he needed help with a cd. He loves my work so we are going with it.
 07/06/2009 09:59:32 AM · #12
You will fall victim to what is known as "recouping" if you try and do it this way...

you won't get paid until the label makes back the money it invested. Thats the same thing that happens to musicians and actors who take a royalty or net position based on the sale.

I think you are better off taking a flat fee for the time being, but put a time limit on the usage (you should NEVER leave usage open ended) and then re-visit it and renegotiate down the road. There is the risk for lost revenue, but by taking a "royalty" you run the risk of making nothing at all.
 07/06/2009 11:09:06 AM · #13
Two points: first, this is the bird in the hand vs. 2 in the bush analogy. You are better off taking the flat fee now, as you will likely get burned by waiting for the "sweeter deal."

Secondly, who are you signing with, the band, their agent or manager, or the label? Even if the band ok's a $1 per copy contract, once they sign with the record label everything changes, including their vision for the cover shot. You may end up with no gig and no money at all.
 07/06/2009 11:22:14 AM · #14
Yeah, I was a little confused by that as well. First you say Universal, but you are meeting with the assistant pastor?

If you aren't dealing with the record label, then I wouldn't expect to have anything finalized until you do. The pastor doesn't represent thier wallets, and I guarantee the record label will not pay out $1 per album sold, based on the idea of "oh yeah, the priest at our church that manages us, he signed this contract with this guy, so we gotta pay him 7% of the album sales.
 07/07/2009 05:38:40 AM · #15
if you really want to know how to structure something like this, you should ask Joey Lawrence about his twilight shoot. i could be completely wrong, but my guess is that there was a nice contract in place, that joey probably retained copyright, and that he gave the studio an unlimited perpetual license to use the images however they want for as long as they want. i imagine he was compensated accordingly for both creative services and for the licensing.

like it or not, most companies do not want to be on the hook for long-term, open-ended, hard-to-measure license arrangements. they want to pay up front and limit the scope of their liability. the value of the licensing is usually a matter of your track record combined with the subject matter. simply taking the picture is not what creates value--unless you're a joey lawrence or someone that well established. if you are just getting started and are taking pictures of a band that is just getting started, do the work, but don't expect those first efforts to add much to your retirement fund ;-)

07/07/2009 07:56:29 AM · #16
As a graphic artist & photographer I have dealt with many bands and 2 different record companies, one was a local label the other was a major label (Warner Bros.). Unless they are a MAJOR and proven artist, the label (i.e. - their art director) will decide on the photographer and photo to be used, they will let the band have input, but since they are footing the bill, they will decide what goes. It won't matter to them what was signed by the artist before they represent them, they will leave the artist on the hook for any contract signed before they signed with the label. The label is investing a lot of marketing money into any band they sign and they are not going to take any chances, it's the labels choice.

I have never heard of a photographer or artist being paid royalties on album covers, unless they are very well known and established. My average for BOTH shooting and graphic design was between$2,500 & $5,000 per album/CD flat fee, decent for freelance, but not going to make me rich. I haven't done this kind of work for about 5 years, but a few friends who are still involved have said as the business is evolving towards online sales the fees are falling as the labels claim their profits are dropping. The label will probably tell you what they will pay and say take it or leave it. By the way, my average on the photography was between $500 & $1,000, the rest was for the design work.

Hopefully the label likes your work and makes an offer, it's a good foot in the door, may add to your freelance work and might lead to more work with them in the future. Good luck.

BTW book publishers work much the same way.
 07/08/2009 02:29:25 PM · #17
Good firsthand information. Joey Lawrence could probably give some good info too.
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