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01/21/2015 10:18:10 PM · #26
Yes. I may have misread the report about the state of the balls at the end of the game. They said that hasn't been revealed.

ESPN reports:

League sources have confirmed that the footballs were properly inspected and approved by referee Walt Anderson 2 hours and 15 minutes before kickoff, before they were returned to each team.

ESPN Sports Radio 810 in Kansas City reported that the Patriots' footballs were tested at the half, reinflated at that time when they were found to be low, then put back in play for the second half, and then tested again after the game. The report did not reveal the results of the test following the game. All of the balls the Colts used met standards, according to the report.

Fine. I'll wait for the official word in a few days. If they are guilty...drop the hammer.

Message edited by author 2015-01-21 22:19:22.
01/21/2015 10:32:05 PM · #27
Originally posted by scalvert:

. How about we wait until actual reports from the investigators, m'kay?

Awkward time for the embattled NFL, no? The SuperBowl event is at risk. If there is an exonerating report to be made, it should come pretty soon to contain the publicity damage. If it's a damning report, it will come after SuperBowl Sunday. I'll guess the latter.
01/21/2015 10:42:07 PM · #28
Originally posted by hahn23:

If there is an exonerating report to be made, it should come pretty soon to contain the publicity damage. If it's a damning report, it will come after SuperBowl Sunday. I'll guess the latter.

The Patriots cannot be exonerated. They are guilty regardless, and if the official report turns out to be some honest mistake or air cooling from a hot one cylinder compressor, then people will just think it's an NFL conspiracy. If there was tampering, then the NFL will have to announce their findings and severe punishment before the Superbowl or lose all credibility. Either way, the Patriots will be branded as cheaters in the Superbowl whether they played honestly or not.
01/21/2015 11:11:52 PM · #29
Probably the best case scenario is they get branded as cheaters AND get blown out in the Super Bowl. Yup. I'm going with that as the best case. :)
01/22/2015 01:31:04 AM · #30
Originally posted by chazoe:



Spoken like all the other Pats apologists. BB must hand out talking points at the gate.


Suggesting that people wait till all the facts are in and a determination made as to the possible involvement of the Patriots makes one an apologist.

I learn new things every day on this site.

Ray
01/22/2015 03:37:58 AM · #31
Originally posted by RayEthier:

Originally posted by chazoe:



Spoken like all the other Pats apologists. BB must hand out talking points at the gate.


Suggesting that people wait till all the facts are in and a determination made as to the possible involvement of the Patriots makes one an apologist.

I learn new things every day on this site.

Ray


I don't.
01/22/2015 08:56:02 AM · #32
Looks like the Ravens tipped off the NFL. Big surprise that team is still whining about their loss.

Message edited by author 2015-01-22 08:56:08.
01/22/2015 09:23:07 AM · #33
NFL rules state that the footballs must be certified between 12.5 13.5 psi and weigh 14 15oz about 2 hours before kickoff, then not tampered with after that. It would be ridiculously easy to meet those conditions and still have balls underinflated by 2psi at halftime. Just inflate flat balls to the proper pressure in the team's sauna shortly before certification. The football's construction would act as a natural insulator, so pressure would be largely maintained for a short time indoors while the ball only feels slightly warm, and 180F sauna air cooling to 50F outside could certainly account for a consistent 2psi while following the rules to the letter. If one football was replaced due to a leak or other defect, then there's your 12th ball, and the backups would have been inflated at room temperature if supplied earlier. Boy, I'll bet that would leave NFL officials feeling "disappointed ... angry ... distraught."

Message edited by author 2015-01-22 09:24:39.
01/22/2015 09:47:02 AM · #34
wouldn't the balls be abnormally hot when they were checked by the officials?

Message edited by author 2015-01-22 09:47:19.
01/22/2015 10:01:07 AM · #35
I heard he has a special low-pressure humidor built into the stadium, and this is the designated room to check the balls. Balls that are underinflated outside the room have a higher relative pressure inside the room, and appear to comply with the rules.

The downside is that you typically feel quite bloated while in the room. This does explain why the one ref's belt was loose.
01/22/2015 10:08:13 AM · #36
Originally posted by Mike:

wouldn't the balls be abnormally hot when they were checked by the officials?

No, apparently they would only have to be inflated with air a little over 90 degrees F, which wouldn't be noticeable through rubber and cowhide, and even so there's nothing about football temperature in the rules.

As an aside, the reason kickers use a separate set of balls shipped directly from the manufacturer is that there were widespread instances of players heating the balls in the 1990's to make them softer. Shouldn't ALL the footballs be treated the same way?

Message edited by author 2015-01-22 10:16:01.
01/22/2015 10:16:26 AM · #37
New England Patriots coach Bill Belichick said Thursday he was "shocked" when he was informed of the allegations that his team used balls that were deflated after they were inspected by officials before the game.
01/22/2015 10:31:52 AM · #38
Originally posted by scalvert:

and even so there's nothing about football temperature in the rules.


that's why there is a standard weight.

if you filled a ball with air of 150+ degrees to the required pressure (expecting the pressure to drop with a temperature drop) the ball would weight less than it should than a ball filled to the proper pressure with room temp air. hence the requirement for a standard pressure AND weight.

PV=nRT

the air mass is a function of the n (the number of moles or air).

01/22/2015 10:38:21 AM · #39
Originally posted by Mike:

that's why there is a standard weight.

90 degree air at 12.5psi in a 14oz ball would cover that easily.

Message edited by author 2015-01-22 10:38:56.
01/22/2015 10:42:22 AM · #40
in order to get a drop of the recorded 2psi, at gametime the air temp was ~50F, so you would need the temp of the ball at filling to be 150+ to get a 2psi drop.

if you filled the balls at 150 degrees or more would the ball still weigh the minimum 14oz?
01/22/2015 10:42:38 AM · #41
Well, Bill passed up the opportunity to explain it through sauna or otherwise. Transcript of press conference.

Did he just throw Tom under the bus?
01/22/2015 10:46:59 AM · #42
My theory is Harbaugh paid the equipment manager of the Pats a bribe to deflate the balls and then told the NFL they wee cheating.

Message edited by author 2015-01-22 10:47:26.
01/22/2015 10:47:47 AM · #43
Originally posted by Mike:

in order to get a drop of the recorded 2psi, at gametime the air temp was ~50F, so you would need the temp of the ball at filling to be 150+ to get a 2psi drop.

Not according to the previously linked university physics professor. "In order for a ball to register a 10.5 PSI in a 50 degree environment but register a 12.5 PSI in the testing environment, the ball would have to have been inflated, stored, and/or tested in a 91 degree environment."
01/22/2015 02:24:09 PM · #44
I'm thinking a good punishment would be for Belichick to have to participate in a reality show where he rooms with Richard Sherman for the preseason. Maybe some of the scenes could be in the hypothetical sauna.
01/22/2015 03:28:40 PM · #45
Originally posted by DrAchoo:

I'm thinking a good punishment would be for Belichick to have to participate in a reality show where he rooms with Richard Sherman for the preseason. Maybe some of the scenes could be in the hypothetical sauna.


I first read that as Richard "Simmons". That would be even better.
01/22/2015 03:35:07 PM · #46
Originally posted by LN13:

Originally posted by DrAchoo:

I'm thinking a good punishment would be for Belichick to have to participate in a reality show where he rooms with Richard Sherman for the preseason. Maybe some of the scenes could be in the hypothetical sauna.


I first read that as Richard "Simmons". That would be even better.

So did I, and it would ... a few hours of "Sweatin' To The Oldies" -- daily -- should re-orient his mindset. He already has the sweatshirt.
01/22/2015 06:11:50 PM · #47
Originally posted by bohemka:

Well, Bill passed up the opportunity to explain it through sauna or otherwise. Transcript of press conference.

Did he just throw Tom under the bus?
''

Not from what I read. He did however suggest that his team inflates the balls the the very minimum level and that any air loss might account for them being under inflated.

Time will tell... or maybe not.

Ray
01/22/2015 08:44:24 PM · #48
I believe Brady has been practicing with low pressure balls all the time, the way he likes them. Maybe he's been doing this for years, so durning the playoff game he noticed no difference. That doesn't make it right, but could bring into a rule change to adjust the tolerance to what the QB prefers. Higher scores make a more interesting game IMO.
Surly with all the video cams going on in the stadium, one would think you could track when this happened, or the NFL doesn't care what happened just like I don't care. But it's great food for the media.
I guess we'll find out next Sunday who has the biggest balls.
01/22/2015 08:57:16 PM · #49
Easy to find dark zones in your own stadium.

I watched the news conferences today and they were dishonest. No way around it. According to their conferences, they had their hand-selected game balls removed from the game in an act so obvious that the start of the second half was delayed. But the head coach and quarterback, who hand-picked those balls, didn't know anything about it until Monday morning. No way.
01/22/2015 09:31:57 PM · #50
Stonewalling. Passing the buck. Throwing others under the bus.

The NFL has yet to interview Brady. What?
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