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DPChallenge Forums >> Current Challenge >> Plagerism???
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11/13/2002 06:53:36 AM · #1
My entry in the current competition has been accused of plagerism and/or being the the same person submitting the same photo as in a previous challenge. Is there any way I can dispute this officialy?

I know commenting on photos being voted on is not allowed in the forums but I would like to explain what I took and why I took it and how it has no intentional connection to a certain other photo (indeed I only took notice of the other one after the comments I recieved on Monday!). I could even get into discussions of prior art and who is copying whom if you like.

I don't mind if you don't like my picture. I don't mind if you think doing X/Y/Z would make it better. I can live with you saying that this picture is using the same idea as that picture (and is better/worse). But I do mind being called a plagerist :-(. Humph.
11/13/2002 07:35:25 AM · #2
Bah, thats nothing. One of my first comments was to accuse John Setzler of plagarizing the previous weeks winner. How was I to know he wins every week?

Recently Ive also been quite deliberatly plagarising images Ive seen here and elsewhere, its the only way to learn, really. Ive also had an image be almost identicle to another submission:
My pic
vs.
this pic.

So it can happen.
11/13/2002 08:34:01 AM · #3
LOL. join the club. i often get inspired by other photos i see on the web. i usually take the idea and by the time i have taken the photo, mine looks pretty different. this challenge, i saw a photo, copied it ... and ... the original i copied was also entered here. and mine looks pretty similar. i had no idea that it was going to be entered here ... ooops :)

as for the comment you received, hendrik. wait 'til the week is over. then you can see who the author is and send him/her an email explaining everything.
11/13/2002 09:29:52 AM · #4
"Plagerism is basic to all cultures" (Woody Guthrie)

Heck, I think we should have a "Plagerism Challenge". Everyone reshoot something someone else shot that we admire. Most original ideas were used up by the 3rd or 4th century.


* This message has been edited by the author on 11/13/2002 9:27:31 AM.
11/13/2002 09:56:05 AM · #5
remember: plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery :)
11/13/2002 10:09:09 AM · #6
I think a "recreate this image" challenge would be a good exercize.

We did the same thing in school last year. The teacher gave us photo "encyclopedias" and we were instructed to photocopy one image and recreate it as best we could. It was a very very helpful assignment.
11/13/2002 10:11:18 AM · #7
i like that idea of giving people a selection of photos to choose from. we could pick them either from submissions to this site or even famous photos. that would be a lot of fun :)
11/13/2002 10:33:44 AM · #8
This would be interesting and fun. Great idea.
11/13/2002 10:38:18 AM · #9
So why not just do it ? It doesn't have to be the 'challenge' topic
of the week - lets do it and share our 'real' and 'copied' versions.
11/13/2002 10:49:11 AM · #10
Yes sir, Gordon. I will be on it right away. ;) hmmmm...Now who should I copy. Should we stay with the photos here at dpc?
11/13/2002 11:13:11 AM · #11
I think we should go outside dpc and pick an image. This way we can't ask how exactly they set up their image.
11/13/2002 11:23:29 AM · #12
I was going to suggest looking on the Masters of Photography' site but it
seems to be down. Anyone else know of a good 'historical photography'
web site with lots of classic images ?
11/13/2002 12:45:16 PM · #13
This is a great thread. I often get really good ideas from this site or other sites in terms of photo technique or presentation. In some ways, that is how I have learned to take pictures. And isn't this kind-of what DPC is about anyway? exposure to new techniques, ideas, etc, given the confines of the challenge? Well, I love the suggestion of finding some classical photo and then trying to reproduce it. Any suggestions for photos?
11/13/2002 12:57:53 PM · #14
I'd suggest going to a local library and finding old photos of your home town -- or even old family photos of the house that you used to live in across town. There's some great history to be learned by doing a "plagerism" challenge like that.

They aren't really presented the way I'd like (I use a screensaver program that crossfades one photo out while the other comes in), but if you want to see some then/now photos I took in London a couple of years ago, you're welcome to have a look. (PS -- if you click on the smaller image on the text page, it will take you to a larger version of the pic.)
Bank of England
Big Ben and Parliament
Natural History Museum
11/13/2002 01:01:28 PM · #15
jeff, those are simply awesome, both in idea and execution. :)
11/13/2002 01:10:25 PM · #16
However, I don't know that we can use a picture that is of a specific monument or person. that would be too hard to duplicate by other people. the subject should be common to everyone taking part. Don't you think?
11/13/2002 01:11:58 PM · #17
sounds fun, ill play.
:)
:)
:)

Originally posted by Gordon:
So why not just do it ? It doesn't have to be the 'challenge' topic
of the week - lets do it and share our 'real' and 'copied' versions.


11/13/2002 01:19:32 PM · #18
Well, first, I was only suggesting it as a personal challenge, not as a dpc one. To be honest, I firmly disagree with all the "it's been done before" comments. Therefore, while I see a personal learning gain from duplicating someone else's work, I have a problem with actually shooting something and saying it's "yours" -- even if you acknowledge the original artist. If by some chance, you happen, by a fluke of nature and the odds, to recreate a shot that you've never seen before, then we have a different situation. If you disagree, that's OK -- I really don't feel like debating anything today. :-)

Secondly, and unrelated, I need to point out something about those three shots I linked to. You very likely will NOT be able to recreate the photo exactly -- and I'm not talking about obvious things like changes over time. Even if you can locate the exact same place in space from which the original photograph was taken, you are almost undoubtedly going to be using a different lens. Your new picture will not line up EXACTLY with the other. You can come close, but will rarely be able to simply overlay one photo on the other. You'll need to rely on PS (or similar) to tweak the photos if that's your goal. Just a quick FYI.
11/13/2002 01:56:08 PM · #19
Originally posted by Hendrik:
I don't mind if you think doing X/Y/Z would make it better.

If your are talking about the pic I think you are talking about, that was my comment and I hope that you learn something from that comment. It is nothing more but advise.

11/13/2002 02:07:36 PM · #20
I wouldn't worry too much, Hendrik. If you used a technique that was "made famous" on dpc by a particular photographer than some people are gonna be a bit weird about it. Of course that doesn't mean that the other photographer came up with the technique, and I think that most of us understand that.
I had a comment on my illusion shot suggesting that the person had seen the exact same shot somewhere before. I did get the idea from the bodyscapes website, but I don't think they have one exactly like it. I didn't even bother to see who left the comment after the challenge because I know that I didn't take someone else's image. Just blow it off and move on.
11/13/2002 02:52:48 PM · #21
I certainly recognised that shot as 'inspired by' the bodyscapes ideas - I don't see the problem with that though - its an original idea that you used and then made your own interpretation of
11/13/2002 02:59:09 PM · #22
Okay, so who has some cats they can lend me - I want to recreate
this picture:

<img border=0 src="//www.posterservice.com/bigpics/20161b.jpg]
11/13/2002 04:03:31 PM · #23
Originally posted by Gordon:
I was going to suggest looking on the Masters of Photography' site but it
seems to be down. Anyone else know of a good 'historical photography'
web site with lots of classic images ?


Tons of images, mostly in the public domain, at the Library of Congress -- this is the main page, but there are several sections which include images (and movies). You can search for what you want or browse catalogs, etc. You can even order prints relatively inexpensively...and some pretty good photographers have worked for the US government.
11/13/2002 07:17:58 PM · #24
Like I said, constructive criticism I have no problems with. I'll be the first to admit that I'm not a perfect photographer (yet :-). And I have learnt a few new tricks since joining DPC.

It's just the fact that everyone and his dog (well about half of the commentors anyway) seems absolutely convinced that I was trying to reproduce another picture and failed. The fact is that I wasn't even aware that this other picture was of a similar technique (and was only vaguely aware it existed).

And by the way, the one genuine criticism I keep getting about how to improve the shot is actualy the very thing I was trying to avoid! Oh well, that's art for you - 100% relative to the viewer.


Originally posted by Azrifel:
Originally posted by Hendrik:
[i]I don't mind if you think doing X/Y/Z would make it better.


If your are talking about the pic I think you are talking about, that was my comment and I hope that you learn something from that comment. It is nothing more but advise.

[/i]
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