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DPChallenge Forums >> Challenge Results >> OK...Who cheated 4-5am challenge?
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12/22/2005 07:17:44 AM · #1
Originally posted by mesmeraj:

i'd get on TooCool, but his best bud Tater was hitting on me other other day, and i wouldn't want to come between friends!

*sorry, couldn't help it*


hmmm...I really wish I had those smiley emoticons, I'm sure there is one that would be perfect right here... ;-)
12/22/2005 03:16:14 AM · #2
Just for the record:
I didn't enter this challenge.

I feel pretty strongly that entrants should try to meet the challenge topic.

I am not a Nazi.

Do I feel that people who didn't follow the description to the letter are cheaters? No.

Do I feel that the entrants who got up and shot between 4 and 5 have a slightly higher level of personal integrity? Yes.

As always, just my two cents.

Thanks for the template coolhar (I hope I didn't cheat)

The question remains - why have such detail challenge description if its Ok to not follow them? or better still why have descriptions at all if we all interpret it differently and we dont have to abide by them?
12/21/2005 07:16:06 PM · #3
Just for the record:

My shot was taken during the prescribed timeframe.

I feel pretty strongly that entrants should try to meet the challenge topic. There is no challenge in rationalizing your way around it.

I am not a Nazi.

I went to a lot of trouble to get my shot. It was about 50 miles from my home. I was questioned by Park Police for being in an area where a gate was supposed to be closed to keep me out. Only because there were no footprints at the gate where my tire tracks were fresh in the still falling snow did they believe me that I didn't open the gate, but rather just drove thru it after someone else had left it open.

Do I feel that people who didn't follow the description to the letter are cheaters? No.

Do I feel that the entrants who got up and shot between 4 and 5 have a slightly higher level of personal integrity? Yes.

As glad2badad says in his signature - "Character is doing what's right when nobody's looking."

As always, just my two cents.
12/21/2005 05:00:14 PM · #4
This is pretty sad. I didn't enter the challenge because I knew I wouldn't be getting up this early to take a picture. Looks like there was some who did and some who didn't. Cheaters! Sorry, just my two cents thrown at you. Go ahead make up excuses to make yourself look good.
12/21/2005 02:53:57 PM · #5
if Patrinus worked at night, and slept during the day, would this be such an issue?

seems like people are just cranky that they actually got up and went somewhere at 3:30am
12/21/2005 02:49:13 PM · #6
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:


.

And not one person commented during the coting that birds don't fly at night. ;-)



I can comment on that one. Birds do fly at night - all the time. Especially during those long migration flights when the sun is too much for them.

Because I knew that, I scored this one high. But I'd have scored this one high in any event.

BTW, I have no opinion on the other aspects of this discussion.
12/21/2005 02:46:29 PM · #7
Originally posted by robs:

Originally posted by aguapreta:

Hmmm, I wonder why no one is getting on TooCool's case? He started the thread and confessed that he did not take his photo between 4-5am. Or is it just if the photo does well, then the person needs to have a virtual flogging.

Heck, last year I had my own brush with infamy in the "Night Shot II" challenge... I came out of the closet and confessed that my photo was actually not a real night shot. Here is the Thread, if anyone cares to look.

But, the bottom line is that not meeting the challenge description is not grounds for a DQ.

It is good to be careful how self righteous you start feeling, next time the witch hunt may find you:)


:shrug: - What can I say, I have the same issue whether it came first or last regardless of who took it or even if nobody knows. I agree it's not against the letter of the rules. Most challenges are subjective in their description but this was not one of them IMO. Each to their own.


How many people think TooCool's shot is "more" within the spirit of the challenge than Patrinus's? TC shot his at a very ungodly hour, after all, and Patrinus just set out to "create the illusion" of 4 AM. Does this matter?

To put it another way, the challenge not only specified the hour of shooting. it also instructed us to set our alarms. Did those who "stayed up" until 4 AM also "cheat" in this challenge? What about someone who is ON THEIR JOB at 4 AM and gets off work at 5 AM, so goes to the parking lot and gets the camera out and takes a shot at 5:10 AM? Is that "cheating"?

Was there any way for me to even "meet" this challenge, given that I am deaf and cannot use an alarm clock? This may sound silly, but it does get to the heart of things; if you're going to crucify people for not following the letter of the description, does it make sense to cut any slack at all? One shoe, two shoes, the dance is endless.

I don't think ANY of the shots in the infamous "Rubber Ducky" challenge were "legal", because there's no such thing as a "rubber" ducky anymore; they're all made of vinyl or somesuch :-)

R.
12/21/2005 02:35:41 PM · #8
Originally posted by aguapreta:

Hmmm, I wonder why no one is getting on TooCool's case? He started the thread and confessed that he did not take his photo between 4-5am. Or is it just if the photo does well, then the person needs to have a virtual flogging.

Heck, last year I had my own brush with infamy in the "Night Shot II" challenge... I came out of the closet and confessed that my photo was actually not a real night shot. Here is the Thread, if anyone cares to look.

But, the bottom line is that not meeting the challenge description is not grounds for a DQ.

It is good to be careful how self righteous you start feeling, next time the witch hunt may find you:)


:shrug: - What can I say, I have the same issue whether it came first or last regardless of who took it or even if nobody knows. I agree it's not against the letter of the rules. Most challenges are subjective in their description but this was not one of them IMO. Each to their own.
12/21/2005 02:35:16 PM · #9
i'd get on TooCool, but his best bud Tater was hitting on me other other day, and i wouldn't want to come between friends!

*sorry, couldn't help it*
12/21/2005 02:34:33 PM · #10
Mine was 4:43 am. That's why I took hubby with me...to be my eyes and ears as I had my focus on taking photos. I did not, however, get up that early...I stayed up. I often have insomnia and have no problem staying awake.
12/21/2005 02:34:24 PM · #11
Originally posted by patrinus:

Art is not related to effort...

I think I'll add that to my signature. :)

-Art (not related to effort)
12/21/2005 02:26:10 PM · #12
' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/419/thumb/266569.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/419/thumb/266569.jpg', '/') + 1) . '

That was taken about 1am....so I wasn't too far off.
12/21/2005 02:25:44 PM · #13
Hmmm, I wonder why no one is getting on TooCool's case? He started the thread and confessed that he did not take his photo between 4-5am. Or is it just if the photo does well, then the person needs to have a virtual flogging.

Heck, last year I had my own brush with infamy in the "Night Shot II" challenge... I came out of the closet and confessed that my photo was actually not a real night shot. Here is the Thread, if anyone cares to look.

But, the bottom line is that not meeting the challenge description is not grounds for a DQ.

It is good to be careful how self righteous you start feeling, next time the witch hunt may find you:)
12/21/2005 02:24:46 PM · #14
My moon photo was taken at 6.40pm but i had little choice as it was well below the horizon at 4am. I really thought a few people would spot this as it was one of the few photos that could be checked. This was my backup photo for the challenge as i was going to shoot the geminid meteor shower at 5am on the 13th but was clouded out.

' . substr('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/419/thumb/268709.jpg', strrpos('//images.dpchallenge.com/images_challenge/419/thumb/268709.jpg', '/') + 1) . '
12/21/2005 02:21:01 PM · #15
Originally posted by patrinus:


I have been thinking whether to submit or not my original image for validation because if I dont submit it then I would be refusing a ribbon that I didn't fully earn... after second thoughts I say it wouldn't be fair to reject a ribbon for an image that voters decided to put where it is now... should I now 'cheat' on the site's rules and not submit my validation?, should I let the voters down? I think not.


Patrinus, I encourage you to submit your original for validation. You took a great shot and I was pleased to see it ribbon.

Not meeting the challenge is not grounds for DQ. We all know this, it's in the rules and it is stated clearly.

As long as all the real rules were followed, as a member, I'd be glad to see your ribbon stand.

12/21/2005 01:59:27 PM · #16
Hmmmmm I love self justification! LOL
12/21/2005 01:57:05 PM · #17
Call me dense but I don't get this art = illusion thing. Art is what it is. It may be an illusion but then again it may not be.
12/21/2005 01:49:06 PM · #18
I have seen lots of posts talking about "other people's effort" put in this challenge... I have put a lot of effort in lots of shots that just sucked and I bet there have been incredible shots ribboning that required very little effort (not the case of my photo in discussion). Art is not related to effort, it's related to beauty and illusions.

If it helps I did live the 4-5am experience in a freezing morning and I very much enjoyed, I even got some very interesting shots. When I saw my bird shot, I noticed that I could make the illusion, that lots of people (and myself) would feel happy about that illusion, that I could tell a story and (I hoped) make someone wish they'd taken the shot. I think it all worked as I hoped. I didn't intend to cheat, I just intended to create something new.

I have been thinking whether to submit or not my original image for validation because if I dont submit it then I would be refusing a ribbon that I didn't fully earn... after second thoughts I say it wouldn't be fair to reject a ribbon for an image that voters decided to put where it is now... should I now 'cheat' on the site's rules and not submit my validation?, should I let the voters down? I think not.
12/21/2005 01:48:29 PM · #19
Originally posted by seancgn68:

I am surprised at how many people here don't think the challenge topic is important to adhere to!


I didn't say that the topic isn't important. I am one of the topic anal people when voting. Not one person said that my shot does not meet the challenge. Therefore as a photographer I did my job. It was not the intention of this thread to bash people for not taking the shot during the supposed critical time period. Since this thread has gone so awry it's also probably the last I will post here...
12/21/2005 01:34:42 PM · #20
Everyone has to feel comfortable with how they approached the challenge. Noone can tell them different.
12/21/2005 01:26:05 PM · #21
If a tree falls in a forest with no one to hear it, then does it make a sound?

If an entry fails to meet a Challenge guidelines but there is no way for voters to verify that, is it a DNMC?

Nordlys
12/21/2005 01:22:15 PM · #22
sorry
i thought photography was the art of capturing an illusion.

I also thought it was clear that the challenge discription was not a rule.

How wrong i am!
12/21/2005 12:49:24 PM · #23
There's no prize here, no penalty for breaking the rules - it's a forum for improving your photographics skills by taking on defined challenges with your virtual friends around the world. It works because we have a common set of boundries for the shot in question, and everyone pretty much stays within the agreed-upon rules.

It is pretty clear that the letter and spirit of this challenge was to take a photo precisely between 4:00 and 5:00 AM. Shooting outside of that window was cheating - allowed since it didn't break the basic/advanced rule sets - but cheating. I didn't enter this challenge - I got up and took a series of shots within the description's time window, but wasn't satisified with the results. Had I had the full 24 hr window and felt comfortable with "faking" the times slot, I am sure that I would have had something worth entering.

It's not that different from playing in a golf tournament with an inflated handicap. You are playing the same game as everyone else, but have given yourself an unfair advantage.

Nothing was won here. Nothing was lost here - but trust.
12/21/2005 12:46:03 PM · #24
Originally posted by sangeeth:

Topic is not a rule and need not be adhered to, and each person is free to make of it what he or she feels best.

That's just plain nonsense.
This site is about "challenges". A number of people go to a great deal of time and trouble to come up with challenge ideas and descriptions. Now why would they do that if none of it needs to be adhered to? Why bother to have challenges at all? Why have a week to submit and vote? Hell, lets just have an open site with no rules or structure - then we could all just have fun - yeehah.

If you like taking photographs but don't want to be bound by rules, there are plenty of places to do that. Surely this is not one of them.

Brett
12/21/2005 12:41:32 PM · #25
Originally posted by patrinus:

I placed the truth in my photo description so that everyone would be able to know what this shot was actually about.


We don't see the description when voting and the title has Moonlight in it - I can see why people could take that the other way.

I guess I learnt something new that I didn't fully understand before - the challenge description should not limit what I photograph and enter.
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