Totally Appaled - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

08/19/2002 05:29:36 AM · #1

Sometimes I think people on this site can't appreciate good photography. I included an "element" in my picture on PURPOSE because it made my subject more interesting. It has interesting placement and the pencil was obvious. i didn't see any other ideas that were the same as mine and yet my score STILL sucks and the comments aren't much better. What is wrong with you guys?

The temptation to never again submit something that I personally am VERY pleased with is very great. Honestly guys it doesn't deserve a score as low as 5.4 Give me a break. *grumble* I'm going back to bed.

floyd

Canon EOS-5D

08/19/2002 05:57:38 AM · #2

5.4 is pretty good.

Sony 16-50mm f/3.5-5.6 E-mount

08/19/2002 06:06:04 AM · #3

Going by last week's scores, 5.4 would put you in the top 50 photographs, ie. way ahead of most of the pack. My photo this week is currently on 5.5 ish, which is the highest I've ever gotten (if it holds).

Your photo is only being judged as "bad" if it's around 4 or lower. Anything between 4-5 is average. Getting over 5 is a good achievement. And virtually everyone who has ever had a photo in the top ten has also had at least one that rated in the low 4s or even in the 3s. So you're doing well!

stephan

Casio QV-4000

08/19/2002 06:41:33 AM · #4

BigSmiles, 5.4 really is a good score. Don't see your score on a 1-10 scale. Winning photos have an 7.x on average so 5.4 is quite good relative to that.

But I see what you mean. Noticing the weekly "this photo should have scored higher" threads I'm not sure if people really see photography as I see. I think many vote mostly on a "gut feeling" and not on the creativity and technique. I have nothing against cute puppies but if it's an uncreative photo and has technically flaws I give it a bad score. Of course my score is also influenced by my "gut feeling" but it's not the only thing. This is not a site where we look at each others family album shots.

I'm currently at 4.5 and I'm very disappointed with that. I had a certain photo in my mind for the first time I was able to reproduce what's in my mind to an actual photo. I like this photo a lot more than other submissions I did which scored higher. Now don't tell me "score is not so important". I know ;-) But oh well.. this should be a rant I guess.

jmsetzler

Sony Alpha a6000

08/19/2002 06:45:33 AM · #5

There is much more to grabbing a high score than simply being unique in the challenge. High scoring photos all seem to have something in common... you should compare yours agains the top photos in several challenges and see if you have those same elements :)

jasonmccarthy

Sony DSLR-A100

Sony 75-300 mm f/4.5-5.6

08/19/2002 06:52:23 AM · #6

true, photography is not about techniques and creativity it is also about that "gut feeling". Why is that just look and remember your most favorite photo what has it got, technically correct, creativity but also a huge gut feeling that tightens your stomach each time you lok at it.

08/19/2002 07:03:51 AM · #7

Originally posted by jasonmccarthy:
Why is that just look and remember your most favorite photo what has it got, technically correct, creativity but also a huge gut feeling that tightens your stomach each time you lok at it.

True .. I like that ... thinking about your personal feelings about a favorite photo.
I am a first timer here, I was happy with my picture this WE, I am an 'amateur' just restarting to take pictures. So .. I was happy, and for some reasons, go figure, I was awake at 4AM, so I gave a look at the entries ... and I thought ... shoot ... I would be happy to be in first half and very happy to be in the first third so ....
true at 4AM at was at 5.287 or something like that and now I am at 4.778 ....
Like we say in french : C'est la vie!
I do not know if you guys do that, I bought a epson 820s printer for 99$ 2 weeks ago ( a GREAT BUY) and last night I printed my photo 8x10, this morning I looked at the print and was happy with what I have done.
And I think that's the greatest pleasure an 'amateur' in the noble sens of the term can get ...
This week is good ... and .. as much as people put in those challenges and as much they put in their photo .... remember .... it's just a photo.
Good luck to everybody who has good faith in their pictures.
Lionel

stephan

Casio QV-4000

08/19/2002 07:19:45 AM · #8

jmsetzler, I know that my photos lack something which the winning photos obviously have. But I didn't say that I think I should win. No way ;-)
I see that the guts feeling is important and a photo only gets a 10 from me if it touches me in a certain way. But this is just a part of it. Technique and creativity together make a higher portion of the score. Especially because this is a learning site (at least to me). Sometimes it looks like people totally ignore the technique and creativity and _only_ score it on their subjective feeling. But this is just my impression. I could be (and probably am) wrong.

Hope this does not sound like I'm bitching around like "my photos are better than yours". It's actually more like "your photo is better than the other". ;-)

TerryGee

Canon EOS-30D

08/19/2002 07:58:23 AM · #9

i'm working on a low one this week too..already told not enough pencil.
All you had to do was have one in the shot, but now it's how much of it I showed?
I give up.
For once people start voting on the artistic..and the good...don't just look for a negative.

Sigma 70-200 /2.8 APO EX DG Macro HSM II

08/19/2002 08:04:39 AM · #10

Well, after starting off over 6, my photo has dropped every hour to now 5.1. Actually, by the time I finish writing this I'll be able to see the next update, and I'm not looking forward to it. You all suck!

TerryGee

Canon EOS-30D

08/19/2002 08:05:30 AM · #11

Originally posted by lisae:
Well, after starting off over 6, my photo has dropped every hour to now 5.1. Actually, by the time I finish writing this I'll be able to see the next update, and I'm not looking forward to it. You all suck!

I totally agree!!!!!

sulamk

Canon EOS-60D

08/19/2002 08:17:33 AM · #12

Mine started at 7 and has now dropped to 4.5! Oh well maybe I will get it right some time!

08/19/2002 08:55:20 AM · #13

Ok guys ... c'est la vie ... we should not looking at it every hour ( I do that as well) and the theme was finally more contreversial than it looks like at the beginning.
Maybe you should not read the comments now ...

BigSmiles

Sigma 15mm f/2.8 EX Diagonal Fisheye for Nikon

08/19/2002 09:05:55 AM · #14

I would like for once to break through this 5.4 score I seem to be getting all the time. There's no reason why my picture should have gotten any scores lower than 3. I'm sick of hearing "you should have done.." "you could have done..".... "why didn't you.." How bout we stop looking at a picture as what it could have been and look at it for what it is. I know I could have chewed up my pencil for this shot but I didn't. Live with it.

I could have left the eraser on the end of it but I didn't. I could have cropped out the interesting shadow in it but then it would just be a shot of a pencil with the "other object" and the image would be boring.

There's a lot of "empty space" not being occupied by the pencil.. and i dont know if some of you understand this but... crowding the edges of your photography with your main subject isn't a good thing. Having space around it to give it an atmosphere is GOOD.

muckpond

Nikon D200

08/19/2002 09:21:46 AM · #15

Ack! Whining!

If you guys are taking photos simply to get a good score and possibly win a challenge, then you're doing it for the wrong reasons, IMHO.

I post pictures here to help me learn what I'm doing and learn what could be better. I had what I thought was a perfect shot last week (perfect = it was exactly what I ws going for) and got kinda reamed for it in some respects. I know now what I did "wrong" or what could have been done better, but I still think it's a kick-a** picture and it's a keeper for me.

Low scores are not anything to be ashamed of. You'll get better and you'll submit pictures that click. Personally, a 5.4 would rock my world. But I'd much rather have a nice shot hanging on the wall and have people enjoy it then win some challenge.

I really really really enjoy this site but sometimes I think the competition kind of ruins the spirit of fun. How many people bombed out one week and then never posted again?

--Rob

myqyl

Nikon D3100

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G DX VR

08/19/2002 09:27:45 AM · #16

I was about to ramble on about how some folks are taking scores and comments to seriously and how they need to lighten up, etc, etc, etc...

Then I remebered 3 or 4 weeks ago... The fear challenge... And my panic rant asking to have my shot removed from the challenge because I had a flurry (4) of comments that made me think the world had mistaken what I meant to say...

We've all been there... Some people will vote low on everything... Some just don't like photography... Some vote low so their entry will do better... Some just have a bug somewhere that bugs weren't meant to be... Most of those folks seem to vote (and comment) on Sunday night...

Welcome to an Open Vote on the Internet...

sulamk

Canon EOS-60D

Sigma 70-200 /2.8 APO EX DG Macro HSM II

08/19/2002 09:35:49 AM · #17

Most of those folks seem to vote (and comment) on Sunday night...

Maybe voting should be blocked until the next morning! A cooling off period, maybe some folks are mad because their entry didn't do as well as expected ... maybe they are just to tired at that time to actually vote subjectively. Never mind I am learning lots, and enjoying it and the creative challenge!

HBunch

HP PhotoSmart 315

08/19/2002 09:36:07 AM · #18

Originally posted by muckpond:
Ack! Whining!

If you guys are taking photos simply to get a good score and possibly win a challenge, then you're doing it for the wrong reasons, IMHO.

I post pictures here to help me learn what I'm doing and learn what could be better. I had what I thought was a perfect shot last week (perfect = it was exactly what I ws going for) and got kinda reamed for it in some respects. I know now what I did "wrong" or what could have been done better, but I still think it's a kick-a** picture and it's a keeper for me.

Low scores are not anything to be ashamed of. You'll get better and you'll submit pictures that click. Personally, a 5.4 would rock my world. But I'd much rather have a nice shot hanging on the wall and have people enjoy it then win some challenge.

I really really really enjoy this site but sometimes I think the competition kind of ruins the spirit of fun. How many people bombed out one week and then never posted again?

--Rob

First off, I was honored to get a 5.4 and 41st place! However, my comments and criticizm were SO much rewarding. I was fortunate to NOT get this, but even a "this photo sucks" comment would have still let me on to know that I did something wrong and to NOT do it again.
I agree with muckpond that if you are here for the score, that is pretty sad.
Here is the reason for the low scores, I originally did it myself and realized that I needed to "grade on a curve" so to speak. I dont think that many of the photos are "visually appealing" That's NOT the fault of the photographers, it's the fault of the subject. Visually appealing meaning something I'd hang in larg form in my livingroom. A little less appealing is something I might put in a smaller photo, on a shelf (or use as a desktop). Less even, something I like, but wouldn't display it anywhere and so on and so on.
I don't care how technically perfect a photo is, if it's a picture of maggots, it's not getting a 10 from me.
I realized while voting that I was giving lower than normal scores to not just one person, but to everyone. I decided that when I got to the technical aspect of the photos and started commenting on them that I would apply the "curve" and bump every photo up a grade (or how ever many I feel it deserves). For example, I have 2 10's and 4 9's. And again, it's not the photographers fault, I realize this and I will compensate for that. I think that when the scores start rolling in, and people start looking at the technical, rather than beauty of the photo, scores will go up.
By the way, the potatoes was #3 on my list. I gave it a 10. I was really hungry that night and those potatoes looked absolutely ravishing!!
My 2 cents this morning.
~Heather~

08/19/2002 09:36:12 AM · #19

muckpond - wow, I had no idea why your photo scored so low until I read the comments and realised that people don't know what "new potatoes" are. How strange. They all suck!

On another note though, whining about too much whining is never a good idea :P. Photography, like anything creative, is a frustrating process. I went to a talk when I was in the US a few weeks ago for SIGGRAPH where animators from Disney, ILM and Pixar bid a "fond farewell" to Chuck Jones. They played lots of clips from his cartoons and rare interviews with him. One of the things he said was that if you are an artist you will die frustrated, but you'll do it because you can't help it. I'm certain that he died frustrated, a great artist like him could not have been otherwise.

When you're frustrated, you have to let it out somehow. Don't begrudge people their venting!

08/19/2002 09:40:26 AM · #20

Yes ...
C'est la vie
It is JUST a picture, I understand being disapointed, thinking it's not fair ... but then ... If you do not want people scoring .. I would say do not post here ... the vote is open .. when you look at some winners, of previous challenges .. they got some 1 and 2 ... .go figure ....
C'est la vie and .. relax a little
And guys , unemployement really SUCKS, and diseases and cancer and ... and .. and ... I am not saying that we should not care about our pictures .. but we should 'rescale' our feelings I think
Lionel

08/19/2002 09:45:39 AM · #21

Ok I will stop posting reply.
That's fine if somebody does not know what 'new potatoes' are .. I am sorry but somebody do not 'suck' because they do not know what a 'new potatoe' is. They probably know something you do not know and they could have put in their pictures as well I guess.

I am new .. and I do not know about 'moderators", sory Lisae, but aren't they suppose to 'moderate' ?

I think I am going top stop reading forums, this thread at least .

Lionel

BigSmiles

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

08/19/2002 09:49:10 AM · #22

You know what it's nice for someone to appreciate something for the same reasons you do. If I can't please someone with my photography how will I have a successful business seeing as that IS what I want to do with my life.

hokie

Nikon D2X

08/19/2002 09:53:39 AM · #23

In my job I tell experienced photographers their stuff sucks everyday:-)

Well, not in those EXACT words but I have to buy photo services and everybody I use is experienced, talented and they know it. BUT...they sometimes miss the idea of what my client needs.

However, these photographers have one advantage all of you guys don't have..they get to submit more than one photograph and they get to reshoot!!! Hehhe

But my point is...sometimes even pro's just don't get the right "feel' to a photo an have to take some criticism.

Ever since I started to play here..many of my photographer friends are laughing saying.."Hahahah..Scott..now you get to be turned down too!!!" :-P

I'll admit..the first really low score or two were hard to take but...once you start feeling good about why you are here playing in the first place it will all even out.

If you get really depressed you shouldn't be here..this is a hobby..not for money..and as a hobby you should derive fun from it..not anger or depression.

muckpond

Nikon D200

Sigma 15mm f/2.8 EX Diagonal Fisheye for Nikon

08/19/2002 09:57:17 AM · #24

Originally posted by lisae:
muckpond - wow, I had no idea why your photo scored so low until I read the comments and realised that people don't know what "new potatoes" are. How strange. They all suck!

Yeah! People suck! LOL...KIDDING!

On another note though, whining about too much whining is never a good idea :P. Photography, like anything creative, is a frustrating process. I went to a talk when I was in the US a few weeks ago for SIGGRAPH where animators from Disney, ILM and Pixar bid a "fond farewell" to Chuck Jones. They played lots of clips from his cartoons and rare interviews with him. One of the things he said was that if you are an artist you will die frustrated, but you'll do it because you can't help it. I'm certain that he died frustrated, a great artist like him could not have been otherwise.

When you're frustrated, you have to let it out somehow. Don't begrudge people their venting!

Oh, you're right Lisa. I shouldn't get frustrated when people vent -- goodness knows I do it quite enough offline. 8) But I've spent the last few weeks trying to compose shots that a) meet the challenge and b) meet the "frame-able" challenge (i.e. i WOULD hand it on the wall, as was mentioned) and have been kinda trashed for it 2 weeks in a row! My highest-rated shot is one I took in the drive-thru at McDonald's the day of the submission deadline! LOL. So, needless to say, I could rant and vent a bit.

I guess my point was this: I take pictures because I like to take pictures. I submit here because I want to take BETTER pictures. I've got a zillion shots that mean a great deal to me and whose emotion I can't convey on a photo challenge website. They may not be technically perfect, but I love them anyway. So, like I said, if you're shooting pictures just to post and win a challenge, I think it's for the wrong reasons.

Ooop...the hour just turned. I have to go see my new score to determined how pissy I should be. ;)

--Rob